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Circuit diagram current fault relay

 

if current in not = to current out (leakage) the breaker will trip  

in denmark 30 mA relays are used

 

 

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Drive a metal stake into the soil outside ....run a wire from your cpu case to the stake....no more shocks!

yes there is a tiny leakage  but it is NOT a fault in the wiring   it is normal, it is an effect of the line emi filter in the equipment, there is no danger   the leakage is so small that it would

There are many types and shapes of EMI line filters   https://www.google.com.ph/search?q=single+pole+emi+filter&espv=2&biw=1523&bih=867&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&am

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I think ideally this is supposed to be routed into the groundED conductor, and that conductor should have low enough impedance that the voltage drop to ground should be effectively zero?

 

the leakage current is very high impedance,  so almost any ground is ok

well a stick in a flower pot is not good enough

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The leakage current comes via a 3 nF capacitor

 

reactance of a 3nF capacitor at 60 Hz is about 885Kohm

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senseless

Hello! Sorry for bringing up this thread from the dead. I want to add a separate circuit for my personal computer and future homelab equipment (FreeNAS server and KVM hypervisor servers).

 

As is the norm here, there is no grounding conductor in the house I am currently staying at. I actually receive a small shock every time I any metallic object that is connected to my computer (e.g. USB ports, connected USB plugs). I have also read somewhere that having a surge protector with no ground makes the surge protector not protecting the connected equipment. Does anyone here have any suggested certified or licensed electrician that could do what I want (and preferably at a low price)? I am located in Lapu-Lapu City, near the Birhen sa Regla Church in Mercado. Our supplier is MECO. Thank you!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Split from THIS TOPIC.

 

 

Installing a ground isn't terribly complex or expensive. I've done it myself in every house I've lived in. When I first started living here I experienced the same thing as you and my computers would die regularly -- needing to replace them once every 3-6 months. Since installing grounds in the houses i've lived in.. I've gone 3 years on the same hardware.

 

Just get a grounding rod, toss it in the ground, and run some cable from the rod to your electrical outlet. Wire the cable to the ground on your outlet. Done.

 

I'd recommend using 12 or 14 awg..

 

If you have a multi meter you can test the voltage between the hot and neutral should be around 240ish volts, from hot to ground around 100v and from neutral to ground around 2-3v.

 

This is how i've done it in mactan and manila. No fried computer equipment since.

 

Is this the proper way to do it? No.

 

Does it work? Yes.

Edited by senseless
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Installing a ground isn't terribly complex or expensive. I've done it myself in every house I've lived in. When I first started living here I experienced the same thing as you and my computers would die regularly -- needing to replace them once every 3-6 months. Since installing grounds in the houses i've lived in.. I've gone 3 years on the same hardware.

 

Just get a grounding rod, toss it in the ground, and run some cable from the rod to your electrical outlet. Wire the cable to the ground on your outlet. Done.

 

I'd recommend using 12 or 14 awg..

 

If you have a multi meter you can test the voltage between the hot and neutral should be around 240ish volts, from hot to ground around 100v and from neutral to ground around 2-3v.

 

This is how i've done it in mactan and manila. No fried computer equipment since.

 

Is this the proper way to do it? No.

 

Does it work? Yes.

 

It is a bit hard to measure between hot and neutral when it is 2 hots

 

You do not need to wire your sockets, just connect your "ground" to the chassis's of your equipment

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senseless

It is a bit hard to measure between hot and neutral when it is 2 hots

 

You do not need to wire your sockets, just connect your "ground" to the chassis's of your equipment

 

2 hots is the same as 2 legs in a 3 phase delta system. It's easy to measure the difference. You stick the multimeter on both ends and presto! you get a reading....

 

In the case of 2 hots you'll get 100v to ground H to G and N/H to G and 240 leg to leg.

 

You can play dictionary if you want but there's always a positive and a negative.

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2 hots is the same as 2 legs in a 3 phase delta system. It's easy to measure the difference. You stick the multimeter on both ends and presto! you get a reading....

 

In the case of 2 hots you'll get 100v to ground H to G and N to G.

 

You can play dictionary if you want but there's always a positive and a negative.

 

Positive and negative in an ac supply ??

 

In the VECO area and also in the MECO area  they use a split phase transformer

just like in north america

 

center tap (neutral) is connected to a ground rod at the pole

2 hots go to the house 

just like in north america

 

neutral does not go to the house

 

I have now used laptops and tabletops for 4 years here all without a ground connected  no problems

 

WIMAX modem and router not grounded either

Edited by Woolf
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senseless

Positive and negative in an ac supply ??

 

In the VECO area and also in the MECO area  they use a split phase transformer

just like in north america

 

center tap (neutral) is connected to a ground rod at the pole

2 hots go to the house

just like in north america

 

It doesn't matter.

 

A surge protector detects a surge from H->N or H->H and shunts it to G. What's going on at the pole is not relevant to the situation as it pertains to sensitive electronics. The G is G. A surge strip, ups, etc is just looking for somewhere to send the excess power when it detects a surge. Which is why none of it matters and you can simply connect a G to that outlet.

 

Yes, there's always a positive and negative. The power always goes somewhere. For instance in a delta system the current goes from A->B, B->C, or C->A. The same occurs here A->B B->A. You can't have a system that goes from A->A. It must flow even if it's to G (or N in a WYE system).... The center tap will do nothing to protect your sensitive electronic equipment. You can ground to it if they run the wire to your house (2 insulated + 1 bare) but you can also just ground yourself... You don't HAVE to use it.

Edited by senseless
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It doesn't matter.

 

A surge protector detects a surge from H->N or H->H and shunts it to G. What's going on at the pole is not relevant to the situation as it pertains to sensitive electronics. The G is G. A surge strip, ups, etc is just looking for somewhere to send the excess power when it detects a surge. Which is why none of it matters and you can simply connect a G to that outlet.

 

Yes, there's always a positive and negative. The power always goes somewhere. For instance in a delta system the current goes from A->B, B->C, or C->A. The same occurs here A->B B->A. You can't have a system that goes from A->A. It must flow even if it's to G.... The center tap will do nothing to protect against sensitive electronic equipment. You can ground to it if they run the wire to your house (2 insulated + 1 bare) but you can also just ground yourself... You don't HAVE to use it.

 

Why are you talking about delta system it is irrelevant

 

Why you think it is called AC   alternating current,  the current change direction 60 times a second, voltages change polarity 60 times a second

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senseless

Why are you talking about delta system it is irrelevant

 

Why you think it is called AC   alternating current,  the current change direction 60 times a second, voltages change polarity 60 times a second

 

 

Delta is what I have the most experience with.

 

Single phase wye (or single phase tapped? I can't ever remember what it's called) is what is used here (IIRC). You have 2 hots and a neutral. If you connect H->N you're going to get a 110V. If you run H->H it will be 240V. If you run H->G it's the same as using the neutral and thus provides a 110V-ish. You DO NOT NEED to use the transformer center tap neutral. You really SHOULD use it, but you can also just pump it straight to ground. In this case, It's not used for constant current. I'm not talking about powering appliances 24/7 using H->G. We're talking about limited cases of surge where excess power will be SHUNTED TEMPORARILY to GROUND.

 

It is OK to run your own ground for this purpose. It's not the proper / standard use case. But it will work and is super easy to do without re-wiring your entire home!

 

The poor OP just wants his computers to stop frying and sending voltage to his chassis -- he's not going to care what the NEC code book says.. As long as it works...

 

Also, In AC the voltage changes polarity -- the flow of electrons doesn't. It doesn't "change direction".

Edited by senseless
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Delta is what I have the most experience with.

 

Single phase wye (or single phase tapped? I can't ever remember what it's called) is what is used here (IIRC). You have 2 hots and a neutral. If you connect H->N you're going to get a 110V. If you run H->H it will be 240V. If you run H->G it's the same as using the neutral and thus provides a 110V-ish. You DO NOT NEED to use the transformer center tap neutral. You really SHOULD use it, but you can also just pump it straight to ground. In this case, It's not used for constant current. I'm not talking about powering appliances 24/7 using H->G. We're talking about limited cases of surge where excess power will be SHUNTED TEMPORARILY to GROUND.

 

It is OK to run your own ground for this purpose. It's not the proper / standard use case. But it will work and is super easy to do without re-wiring your entire home!

 

The poor OP just wants his computers to stop frying and sending voltage to his chassis -- he's not going to care what the NEC code book says.. As long as it works...

 

Also, In AC the voltage changes polarity -- the flow of electrons doesn't. It doesn't "change direction".

Also, In AC the voltage changes polarity -- the flow of electrons doesn't. It doesn't "change direction".

 

Complete nonsense

 

I already in a very early post in this thread said  use a grounding spike  and connect a wire from there to the chassis's  of the equipment

 

it is you that bring up current flow delta connections  Y- connections   and that current flows in same direction no matter the voltage potential

 

electrons ALWAYS flows from negative to positive   ( you want them to flow "up hill")

Edited by Woolf
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In the southern hemisphere they go the other way, of course. 

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In the southern hemisphere they go the other way, of course. 

 

 

        :ROFLMAO:  :ROFLMAO:  :ROFLMAO:  :yahoo:  :crazy:  :tease:

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senseless

Also, In AC the voltage changes polarity -- the flow of electrons doesn't. It doesn't "change direction".

 

Complete nonsense

 

I already in a very early post in this thread said  use a grounding spike  and connect a wire from there to the chassis's  of the equipment

 

it is you that bring up current flow delta connections  Y- connections   and that current flows in same direction no matter the voltage potential

 

electrons ALWAYS flows from negative to positive   ( you want them to flow "up hill")

 

I was only talking about positive and negative in the sense of potential between 2 lines. Not actual positive and negative charges. I'm sorry I don't know all the terms enough to make you happy.

 

I was bringing up delta and Y as they are the only ones I have experience with. Y is the closest thing I have experience with compared to what is setup here for homes.

 

Connecting a ground to his chassis isn't going to protect the computer. It's going to send any surge through his computer still and fry all the components. I was trying to give the guy a solution that would actually protect his equipment.

 

Feel free to continue playing wordsmith.

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I was only talking about positive and negative in the sense of potential between 2 lines. Not actual positive and negative charges. I'm sorry I don't know all the terms enough to make you happy.

 

I was bringing up delta and Y as they are the only ones I have experience with. Y is the closest thing I have experience with compared to what is setup here for homes.

 

Connecting a ground to his chassis isn't going to protect the computer. It's going to send any surge through his computer still and fry all the components. I was trying to give the guy a solution that would actually protect his equipment.

 

Feel free to continue playing wordsmith.

 

potential, charge = voltage

 

Have a look at the drawing below,  that is how electricity is supplied to homes here

top drawding is for VECO, MECO and atleast some areas in manila

 

mid drawing is other areas in philippines

 

bottom drawing north america

post-6705-0-34419100-1446185001_thumb.jpg

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