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Lost Malaysian airliner


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Majorsco

I don't for see a big giant passport database for the world or even separate accessible

 

ones. There is a lot of data on people that would not be good to get out.

 

If there were such a database would it also track people's movements? China wants to know who visits Taiwan or Tibet, and US wants to know if its citizens visit Cuba, for example. Something such people don't want openly available for airlines or govt's.

 

Even it were just to identify people against the credentials, how would it be kept up to date with new passports, renewed passports, passports with name changes, lost ones, confiscated ones (such as temp confiscation by a court).

 

As such I don't think its a SNAFU, just an imperfect system.

 

For this Malaysian flight, if a system like this existed it could still be countered by terrorists. All it would take is to book a flight under the name of someone who willingly gave the passport, or steal it just in time from someone who wouldn't know it was missing.

 

 

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They don't necessarily wish to fly it into a building. If they did it would already have been reported by the time you made the above post.   The US isn't the only country anyone in the world thinks

I dunno flame me if you will, but there were a lot of people on that plane and all these flippant comments seem rather disrespectful to those who are missing and their families.  My view anyway.

High tech drones are flown remotely every day.   But a commercial airliner that can be taken over by remote control on demand - horseshit   They aren't talking about a specific airframe that has b

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Bill H

I see your points Scott, but I don't agree at all.  Surely a database could be formed that would allow airlines to verify the authenticity of a passport.  No need to check destination, just need to know if the passport is valid and the picture on the passport matches the picture on the passport being submitted.  Governments could update the db daily as they issue new passports etc.  This is not rocket science and it is not being done, but surely needs to be.

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Monsoon

More and more countries are not even stamping your passport, instead giving you an entry receipt. I really like this. It is nobody's business where I have been. 

 

I always scratch my head at some of the security protocols. For years in the US two major triggers for extra screening (perhaps still are?) were last minute bookings and one way flights. Well I did a lot of those in my line of work and was very often a 'selectee' for extra screening. What a pain in the ass and totally useless. If I was able to figure this one out you would think so would criminals who would simply book a round trip ticket in order to reduce the chances of being selected. 

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Woolf

I see your points Scott, but I don't agree at all.  Surely a database could be formed that would allow airlines to verify the authenticity of a passport.  No need to check destination, just need to know if the passport is valid and the picture on the passport matches the picture on the passport being submitted.  Governments could update the db daily as they issue new passports etc.  This is not rocket science and it is not being done, but surely needs to be.

take this link, the database is already there

 

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missing-jet/missing-passport-databases-not-routinely-checked-interpol-n48261

 

link already posted in post #32

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Majorsco

take this link, the database is already there

 

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missing-jet/missing-passport-databases-not-routinely-checked-interpol-n48261

 

link already posted in post #32

That is a database of stolen or missing passports not one for validity of passports in general to see if its valid, not the same.

 

This database would rely on a number of factors to work.  First is how fast the passport owner knows that the passport is missing or stolen.  That could be instantaneous, if taken directly from the person, or weeks/months if it is stored and lost or stolen without being discovered.  Second is how fast the report of lost or stolen passports is reported to Interpol who owns this database.  How efficient are the police/govt agencies that do this to get it into the database.  Third is that the database is updated properly and the data maintained, ie, data entered accurately with no omissions or errors.  Fourth, that the database is actually used, which this article indicates that it is often not used.

 

The type of database the Bill H was wanting based on his comments and what I responded to was not merely a database of lost or stolen passports, but one that has all the passport data to ensure its validity.

 

While the Interpol database is better than nothing, it is a far cry from a strong tool to prevent terrorists or criminals from using lost or stolen passports.  It wouldn't even catch a fake passport, which is much harder to create with the new e-passports with the biometric data embedded.

 

 

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Additionally, oil slick samples found about 100 nautical miles from Malaysia's east coast of Kelantan, just south of the point of last contact, turned out to have no connection to the missing plane after analysis by Malaysian authorities.

 

http://gma.yahoo.com/oil-slick-samples-debris-not-connected-missing-jetliner-120149307--abc-news-topstories.html?vp=1

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Bill H

Well it just sucks anyway you look at it.  If someone can travel with impunity on a passport stolen more than two years ago then what's the point of the whole passport game?  I still find it incredible the system is so weak this can happen.  That's just shameful to me.

 

For those who argue we no longer need a strong military because terrorism is on the wane and the world is now mostly at peace, I give you the Ukraine and the Malaysian missing plane case.  That plane did not detour to North Korea to take in the sights.  It more than likely blew up at altitude and that is more than likely because someone wanted to blow it up.  Lots of sick people in the world and America better find that big stick and start carrying it around for sure.  <sigh>  

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Alan S

I think it is far too early to start talking about terrorism.

 

There are other possibilities, so lets wait for the experts to find some evidene and, hopefully, the cause.

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Bill H

I think it is far too early to start talking about terrorism.

 

There are other possibilities, so lets wait for the experts to find some evidene and, hopefully, the cause.

 

:bomb: :bomb: :bomb::rose::coffee:

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Jess Bartone

I too am perplexed about the stolen passports. When I re-enter Oz they lay my passport on the chip reader and read that rather than the printed data. I don't know what information comes up because I can't see the screen. When my wife came to Australia she didn't even have a visa stamp, just a letter to show Philippines authorities at the exit point, and then in Oz her name came up instantly on their database and they stamped in the entry date.

 

So this is why I find the case at hand so perplexing, wasn't Malaysia the first country to implement the database system? Why didn't the alarm bells go off? One could speculate that there is something deeply sinister going on - note, "speculation" - it is possible there was corruption at the exit point.

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Question to aviation experts here, I`m definitely not one.

 

1. Is it possible these days to hijack commercial airline full of passengers and to land it somewhere without ….anyone noticing or reporting it. 

2. Commercial size airliner ….just disappearing from radar, other than total mid-air destruction,... is there reasons way radar could not pick it up no longer?

3. Could there been “ accidental “ shooting it down …cover up ?
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stevensanph

1. You would need a sizeable runway for a 777, but I suppose there could be numerous WWII abandoned bases around SEA. It was fueled for Beijing, so anywhere in Asia is theortically possible.

2. I am confused by the searching the Malacca straits.  The plane was the other direction.  For them to be searching there means they have some radar blips suggesting it might have turned around and was heading that direction.  For it to 'disappear' from radar would have required turning off the transponder, going as fast as possible and probably flying at low altitude.  I can't believe no one would have noticed a sizeable jet flying low over Malaysia though, so why do they think the plane is in the Malacca Straits??

3. I had that thought after watching air crash investigation last night, when an Air West Jet got cut in two by an unsuspecting military F4 flight over California.  A Malaysian of Vietnamese jet bringing down a plane full of Chinese wouldnt go down well in Beijing I guess!

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OrmocArse

Question to aviation experts here, I`m definitely not one.

 

1. Is it possible these days to hijack commercial airline full of passengers and to land it somewhere without ….anyone noticing or reporting it.

2. Commercial size airliner ….just disappearing from radar, other than total mid-air destruction,... is there reasons way radar could not pick it up no longer?

3. Could there been “ accidental “ shooting it down …cover up ?

I'm not an expert, but I'm going to take a stab at this nonetheless.

 

1. Its not possible to make the plane disappear from radar when its still in the sky. The most someone can do is turn off the transponder which provides flight info to the radar blip on the screen. But the blip itself will not disappear. So someone would have been able to track its route even if hijacked and diverted.

 

2. Nose first or belly first into the ocean will cause it to disappear from radar.

 

3. Its happened before, no way to say it couldn't have happened again.

 

On a side note people seem to be getting suspicious of the fact that the plane has not been found yet. Please keep in mind it took search and rescue 5 days to find the first sign of wreckage from the Air France Flt 447 disaster, and nearly 2 years to find the main wreckage. If the airplane entered the water intact, just as the Air France flight did, only a few of the pieces will be visible at the surface. A near needle in a haystack situation.

 

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

 

 

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the.lone.gunman

If it blew up in midair there would be a large debris field . If it went into the water basically intact it would be very difficult to find.

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OrmocArse

If it blew up in midair there would be a large debris field . If it went into the water basically intact it would be very difficult to find.

Exactly, which is why I suspect there was no midair explosion, or the debris field probably would have been found by now.

 

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

 

 

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