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Rich People Actually Don't Create The Jobs


Salty Dog

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lifeisgood

If only it were that simple.  Banks, mortgage companies, and other financial service firms had a role in the crash to be sure.  However, you  ignore the government's role who during the last 20 years or longer set the stage for banks to offer the mortgage products they did, and for the pressuring/forcing of the issuance of mortgages to people who could not qualify.  That has been going on by the Democratic party since Carter's presidency till the time of the crash.  Bush's team warned of the impending crash but the Democratically controlled congress (and in particular Rep Barney Frank) refused to hear of it.

 

Then you have the people themselves buying what they know they can't afford.

 

 

 

There is a lot of blame to go around, but many lay the blame solely on the bankers.

 

I would say the people had less of a role.  You think they understood they couldn't afford those loans but that would be naive on your part.  Mortgage brokers know how to sell.  That is their jobs.  They sold these people on monthly payments.   Most people didn't realize those payments would be going up because the rates were adjustable.   You can think people should have known but these are not exactly easy concepts for the average person to understand.

 

If it were easy we wouldn't need lawyers, title companies, loan brokers, title insurance, etc...

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You sound like a guy who has never done a loan.   Most definitely someone who hasn't worked with a lot of mortgage brokers.   A 6th grade reading level is going to know what this verbage means, eh?

Yeah, and it had nothing to do with people buying shit they couldn't afford and stacking up debt. Must have been the fault of the evil banks who gave the retarded middle class exactly what they asked

By Henry Blodget, Business Insider   As America struggles with high unemployment and record inequality, everyone is offering competing solutions to the problem. In this war of words (and classes), o

I would say the people had less of a role. You think they understood they couldn't afford those loans but that would be naive on your part. Mortgage brokers know how to sell. That is their jobs. They sold these people on monthly payments. Most people didn't realize those payments would be going up because the rates were adjustable. You can think people should have known but these are not exactly easy concepts for the average person to understand.

 

If it were easy we wouldn't need lawyers, title companies, loan brokers, title insurance, etc...

If you read the small print it's pretty damn easy to understand for anyone with a 6th grade reading and vocabulary level. If you don't read before you sign a contract you are an idiot and deserve what's coming to you. First thing I think when someone tries to sell me something that sounds too good to be true (really anything) is, "what's the catch? What's in it for you? How much profit are YOU turning over?". There is very little in this world being sold that I don't call BS on or deem it overpriced.

 

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lifeisgood

If you read the small print it's pretty damn easy to understand for anyone with a 6th grade reading and vocabulary level. If you don't read before you sign a contract you are an idiot and deserve what's coming to you. First thing I think when someone tries to sell me something that sounds too good to be true (really anything) is, "what's the catch?". There is very little in this world being sold that I don't call BS on or deem it overpriced.

 

You sound like a guy who has never done a loan.   Most definitely someone who hasn't worked with a lot of mortgage brokers.

 

A 6th grade reading level is going to know what this verbage means, eh?

 

 

 Borrower covenants that Borrower is lawfully seised of the estate hereby conveyed and 
has the right to mortgage, grant and convey the Property, that the Property is 
unencumbered, and that Borrower will warrant and defend generally the title to the 
Property against all claims and demands, subject to any declarations, easements or 
restrictions listed in a schedule of exceptions to coverage in any title insurance policy 
insuring Lender's interest in the Property.
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Then you have the people themselves buying what they know they can't afford.

 

 

 

There is a lot of blame to go around, but many lay the blame solely on the bankers.

No, the people are the ONLY ones to blame. As long as there are enough idiots out there creating a demand for buying shit they can't afford there will be someone out there who will take advantage of the idiots. Greed and keeping up with the Jones' is a great business plan. Unfortunately the government must step in and regulate to stop (the government calls it "protecting" so that these morons don't get butt hurt and have to feel they are responsible for their unwise financial decisions) the greedy illiterate middle class population from screwing it up for the rest of us.

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You sound like a guy who has never done a loan. Most definitely someone who hasn't worked with a lot of mortgage brokers.

 

A 6th grade reading level is going to know what this verbage means, eh?

Why would I need to work with one? I'm not going to buy something I can't afford/pay cash for. The debt that I mentioned I had was back when someone almost had me convinced I needed to fall into the credit game. I now know better.

 

(I took a 4k USD loan out on a 27k new truck. I could have paid cash for it all from my savings but my parents had me convinced I needed credit. All but one bank turned me down for the loan......this is when I found out that the credit game is absolutely ridiculous. If I had the opportunity to finance someone 4k for a 27k truck on terms that he didn't pay I would get the truck I'd be all over that shit......and praying that he didn't pay. Btw, i was 20 when I had 30k saved up from working summer jobs throughout high school. My parents did teach me the value of saving.....they said it was for rainy days though. I took it a bit further. Only buy......EVERYTHING......with cash.)

 

You're right, out of context I have absolutely no idea what verbiage means. But you better bet I would take that contract home and pull out the dictionary and/or start googling, if I couldn't figure it out I would hire a lawyer (which seems like a better and cheaper idea than losing a house you already paid thousands and thousands of dollars on). If they told me I had to sign today I'd tell them to stuff that contract up their ass and walk out. Rushing someone to sign or buy sets of my scamdar.

 

There is no excuse for signing something you don't understand or buying something you can't afford......you are an IDIOT for doing either one, simple as that.

 

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lifeisgood

Why would I need to work with one? I'm not going to buy something I can't afford/pay cash for. The debt that I mentioned I had was back when someone almost had me convinced I needed to fall into the credit game. I now know better. (I took a 4k USD loan out on a 27k new truck. I could have paid cash for it all from my savings but my parents had me convinced I needed credit. All but one bank turned me down for the loan......this is when I found out that the credit game is absolutely ridiculous. If I had the opportunity to finance someone 4k for a 27k truck on terms that he didn't pay I would get the truck I'd be all over that shit......and praying that he didn't pay. Btw, i was 20 when I had 30k saved up from working summer jobs throughout high school. My parents did teach me the value of saving.....they said it was for rainy days though. I took it a bit further. Only buy......EVERYTHING......with cash.) You're right, out of context I have absolutely no idea what verbiage means. But you better bet I would take that contract home and pull out the dictionary and/or start googling, if I couldn't figure it out I would hire a lawyer (which seems like a better and cheaper idea than losing a house you already paid thousands and thousands of dollars on). If they told me I had to sign today I'd tell them to stuff that contract up their ass and walk out. Rushing someone to sign or buy sets of my scamdar. There is no excuse for signing something you don't understand or buying something you can't afford......you are an IDIOT for doing either one, simple as that.

 

Ah, so you never took out a mortgage yet you are trying to tell us a 6th grade reading comprehension would understand the loan documentation.  Not to mention everything else you need to sign when you purchase a house.  On top of that you have never had the experience of working with a mortgage broker.  You seem to know a lot with no experience to back it up.   You should stop now.

 

Hording money (saving) in the bank will only make you poorer.  

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I would say the people had less of a role.  You think they understood they couldn't afford those loans but that would be naive on your part.  Mortgage brokers know how to sell.  That is their jobs.  They sold these people on monthly payments.   Most people didn't realize those payments would be going up because the rates were adjustable.   You can think people should have known but these are not exactly easy concepts for the average person to understand.

 

If it were easy we wouldn't need lawyers, title companies, loan brokers, title insurance, etc...

 

 

The proportion of subprime ARM loans made to people with credit scores high enough to qualify for conventional mortgages with better terms increased from 41% in 2000 to 61% by 2006. In addition, mortgage brokers in some cases received incentives from lenders to offer subprime ARM's even to those with credit ratings that merited a conforming (i.e., non-subprime) loan.[103]

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subprime_mortgage_crisis

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Majorsco

Maybe what we need is a new governmental agency entitled "Dim Wit Protection Agency" (DWPA) with its mission to protect those uneducated, inexperienced idiots from doing something that they can't understand and can't afford.  The massess need to be protected against their own bad, impulsive actions so they won't do anything that may hurt them later.

 

Let the elite protect them for the betterment of elite-kind.

 

:wheel:

 

That's the progressive approach.

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Majorsco

The proportion of subprime ARM loans made to people with credit scores high enough to qualify for conventional mortgages with better terms increased from 41% in 2000 to 61% by 2006. In addition, mortgage brokers in some cases received incentives from lenders to offer subprime ARM's even to those with credit ratings that merited a conforming (i.e., non-subprime) loan.[103]

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subprime_mortgage_crisis

 

Don't forget to state the reason those people took the ARM loans when they could have the conforming one.  They took the lower upfront payments so they could buy cars, big screen TVs, computers, or pay for other things that they wanted. 

 

I knew lots of people that looked at the loans this way.  Also, many that refinanced, after the intro period would take cash out of the property so again, they could buy something, ratther than to solidify the financial position by actually paying down the loan or letting the paid down loan stay paid down.

 

The ME generation is not just about ME, but also about instant gratification. 

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lifeisgood

The proportion of subprime ARM loans made to people with credit scores high enough to qualify for conventional mortgages with better terms increased from 41% in 2000 to 61% by 2006. In addition, mortgage brokers in some cases received incentives from lenders to offer subprime ARM's even to those with credit ratings that merited a conforming (i.e., non-subprime) loan.[103]

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subprime_mortgage_crisis

 

 

Like I said, mortgage brokers are simply sales people.  They may have offered different packages but sold them on the one that pays the most points.

 

"Look Mr Buyer, you could get this conventional fixed rate loan but here is a loan that you pay $100 less a month.  Which one would you be interested in?"

 

 I bet most of the people don't realize how mortgage brokers make their money.

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Ah, so you never took out a mortgage yet you are trying to tell us a 6th grade reading comprehension would understand the loan documentation. Not to mention everything else you need to sign when you purchase a house. On top of that you have never had the experience of working with a mortgage broker. You seem to know a lot with no experience to back it up. You should stop now.

 

Hording money (saving) in the bank will only make you poorer.

I've signed plenty of contracts and read plenty of legal fine print. Again, there is no excuse for signing something you don't understand. Already stated if I couldn't understand it I would pay someone to explain it to me. They aren't making up their own language, it can be researched if you don't understand. You're trying to make excuses for idiots.

 

I would agree about hording money in a bank. If you are just keeping your money sitting in a checking account you aren't too bright. I never said not to invest......just to invest what you can afford to invest. But to say saving money makes you poorer is just plain stooped.

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lifeisgood

I've signed plenty of contracts and read plenty of legal fine print. Again, there is no excuse for signing something you don't understand. Already stated if I couldn't understand it I would pay someone to explain it to me. They aren't making up their own language, it can be researched if you don't understand. You're trying to make excuses for idiots.

 

 

 

I am not trying to make excuses for idiots.  They may have been ignorant, like what you have displayed, but that doesn't necessarily mean they are stupid.  They trusted someone who is suppose to be an expert and was suppose to do what was right for the customer, namely them.  Getting scammed doesn't mean you are stupid.  You say get someone to explain it and I am saying they had someone to explain it and they got screwed.

 

People go to law school in order to draft documents such as the ones used in loans.  My sister being one of them.  Saying you can research it is silly.

 

You obviously are talking about stuff you have no clue about.  That doesn't mean you are stupid, just ignorant.  The problem is you think you know it all.

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Majorsco

 

 

I am not trying to make excuses for idiots. They may have been ignorant, like what you have displayed, but that doesn't necessarily mean they are stupid. They trusted someone who is suppose to be an expert and was suppose to do what was right for the customer, namely them. Getting scammed doesn't mean you are stupid.

 

While there are possibly a few people that actually got scammed, most did not.  To be scammed, a fraud had to happen.  They were naive, stupid, or just ignorant.  A salesman/mortgage broker that offers something that the buyer may or may not understand is not a scam.  If the buyer signs not knowing what they signed, it is on the part of the buyer unless there is fraud in the inducement which is criminally liable as well as liable in a civil proceding.

 

Used to be people not understanding a contract would take it to a lawyer that represented them to get advice.  Now people don't want to pay the price of the lawyer and think they're just fine without the advice if they are a low knowledge buyer.  If they trust the wrong person, who is responsible - They are for trusting them. 

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lifeisgood

While there are possibly a few people that actually got scammed, most did not.  To be scammed, a fraud had to happen.  They were naive, stupid, or just ignorant.  A salesman/mortgage broker that offers something that the buyer may or may not understand is not a scam.  If the buyer signs not knowing what they signed, it is on the part of the buyer unless there is fraud in the inducement which is criminally liable as well as liable in a civil proceding.

 

Used to be people not understanding a contract would take it to a lawyer that represented them to get advice.  Now people don't want to pay the price of the lawyer and think they're just fine without the advice if they are a low knowledge buyer.  If they trust the wrong person, who is responsible - They are for trusting them. 

 

I was heavy into real estate at the time of the bubble.  I actually got out before the bubble burst.   I saw first hand what was going on.  My sister represents people who got taken advantage of.  You can have any opinion you want and I am not interested in trying to change your mind.  

 

Most people sign purchase contracts with real estate agents without seeing a lawyer.  Say what you want, that is common practice.   

 

The whole trusting thing is their fault logic is what I would classify as bullshit.  You trust people all the time from doctors to mechanics to plumbers.  Next you're going to tell me someone who takes a drug that was suppose to be safe and dies should have known better.

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Majorsco

Yes it is their fault if they sign something they don't understand and don't get advice from a lawyer that represents their interests.  Being common practice doesnt remove their responsibility for knowing what they are signing.  In years past people almost always went to a lawyer for such things.  Now people think they know better, and look what it gets them.

 

Caveat Emptor used to be practiced.  Now, its been replaced by, Oh, if I'm wrong, I can just get out of it, blame someone else, or just file a lawsuit.  Trust at your own peril.  If I hire a plumber or other specialist, I don't trust blindly.  I get reviews from prior customers and determine their track record before trusting. 

 

Same with doctors, I get to know a doctor from other patients before I see the doctor. 

 

Justifying bad practice by saying its common practice doesn't make it good practice. 

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