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Omni 3-way Switch Wiring Diagram.


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You have to be very careful when you talk about electrical utility installation/systems here in the philiphines

 

Some areas have split phase (2 phase) 220/240v  and I think some areas have single phase and neutral 220/240v

 

I only know about VECO cebu and  it is split phase (2 phase) 220/240v center tap pole transformer grounded

Edited by Woolf
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Brilliant example of how to go off-topic in two posts. It can't be done any faster than that. 

Greetings! Forums are ment to be a place to have a casual conversation between intrested members discusing what we are doing with our time, and are not allways toeing the party line. Cave men, flying

Greetings! The "KEY" is "Three-ways are fairly easy to implement provided you have the right switches and you can follow the diagram." That is why I posted the diagram. Yes I do have dry wall, with

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ed villas

 

You have an interior dry wall wall ??  I have never seen one here so far   [ some ceilings tho ]

Brilliant example of how to go off-topic in two posts. It can't be done any faster than that.  :cool:

 

yes it is ashame that when someone has a GREAT TOPIC it always seems to get sidetrack by some???? one,

 hope that FS/MOD can help the forum by keeping the topic and its post staying more on focus . :wave:

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Davaoeno

 

 

You have an interior dry wall wall ??  I have never seen one here so far   [ some ceilings tho ]

Brilliant example of how to go off-topic in two posts. It can't be done any faster than that.  :cool:

 

yes it is ashame that when someone has a GREAT TOPIC it always seems to get sidetrack by some???? one,

 hope that FS/MOD can help the forum by keeping the topic and its post staying more on focus . :wave:

since ed villas thinks this is such a GREAT TOPIC  i thought i would look to see how many comments he made on the topic ? Whats that you say p ed villas had absolutely nothing to say on the matter- not even one post ??  

 

One has to wonder why ed villas was moved to make this post ?  Maybe to try to get his thanks count up from 18 ? Nah- that cant be the reason !  So what other reason could he possibly have .  Oh by the way ed villas- my post was related to the OP's post - and thus on topic, whereas yours has absolutely nothing to do with the OP's post  - and in fact doesnt even relate to anything at all in the OP's post 

But feel free to express your outrage at people posting related things while you continue to post nothing but  troll  posts !! 

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trthebees

You have to be very careful when you talk about electrical utility installation/systems here in the philiphines

 

Some areas have split phase (2 phase) 220/240v  and I think some areas have single phase and neutral 220/240v

 

I only know about VECO cebu and  it is split phase (2 phase) 220/240v center tap pole transformer grounded

 

Interesting point. We're Cebeco, 230 and neutral/ground. And we are grounded at the house too.

 

On the VECO system, do you have  a 115v lighting circuit? It would feel a bit hairy screwing in a 230V light bulb when the outer screw area is also at 115V, considering the tendency is just to turn the wall switch off when changing a bulb, not the double pole breaker.

 

I think what they do in the US sometimes on a 3 wire system (aka split phase sometimes) is to give 110 for lighting and socket outlets, and a separate 220V circuit between phases with double pole switches for heavier appliances like aircon.

 

All corrections welcome.

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On the VECO system, do you have a 115v lighting circuit? It would feel a bit hairy screwing in a 230V light bulb when the outer screw area is also at 115V, considering the tendency is just to turn the wall switch off when changing a bulb, not the double pole breaker.

 

 

VECO supply area:

 

All are 220/240v  outlets, lighting, all.

 

Yes they use single pole light switches and dual pole breakers.

 

Yes the outer screw area can be 110/120v in reference to ground, I dont think they care what wire they put to center or to outer screw area

Edited by Woolf
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trthebees

 

VECO supply area:   All are 220/240v  outlets, lighting, all.   Yes they use single pole light switches and dual pole breakers.   Yes the outer screw area can be 110/120v in reference to ground, I dont think they care what wire they put to center or to outer screw area

 

Ta, I guess everyone takes extra care when replacing a bulb, particularly as some of the cheaper fittings sold here leave the threaded portion exposed even after screwing in. 

And i wonder if they fit a black sleeve to the white if they use two core to indicate live.

In the UK, with the two way (US three way) switches, it's fairly common to use two core and earth to run between the two two way switches. The black core should be sleeved red to indicate that it could be live.

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RogerDat

 

VECO supply area:   All are 220/240v  outlets, lighting, all.   Yes they use single pole light switches and dual pole breakers.   Yes the outer screw area can be 110/120v in reference to ground, I dont think they care what wire they put to center or to outer screw area

 

Ta, I guess everyone takes extra care when replacing a bulb, particularly as some of the cheaper fittings sold here leave the threaded portion exposed even after screwing in. 

And i wonder if they fit a black sleeve to the white if they use two core to indicate live.

In the UK, with the two way (US three way) switches, it's fairly common to use two core and earth to run between the two two way switches. The black core should be sleeved red to indicate that it could be live.

Greetings! U really lost me on this post. It seams to cover three countries in very few words.

I plan to hook up a circuit using 12VDC and experiment whitch combo works with the switches we have in Cebu.

I will make pictures, and post, that way, no problems, (normaly should be no problems) come up!

Wish we could hire a compitant electricion, or some one who knows what he is doing here, and he advertised it with refrences, and WORKING phone numbers! That would inpress me no end.

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VECO supply area:   All are 220/240v  outlets, lighting, all.   Yes they use single pole light switches and dual pole breakers.   Yes the outer screw area can be 110/120v in reference to ground, I dont think they care what wire they put to center or to outer screw area

 

Ta, I guess everyone takes extra care when replacing a bulb, particularly as some of the cheaper fittings sold here leave the threaded portion exposed even after screwing in. 

And i wonder if they fit a black sleeve to the white if they use two core to indicate live.

In the UK, with the two way (US three way) switches, it's fairly common to use two core and earth to run between the two two way switches. The black core should be sleeved red to indicate that it could be live.

 

It's nothing to do with the fittings.  In my (limited) experience the PH provides a two-phase, 127v supply - 127 x sq. rt 3 = 220v.  Both sides of the circuit to a 220v light bulb will be live and the switch only isolates one of them to break the circuit; so one side, which may be the thread, remains live.  Only recently has the PH stocked and sold ganged circuit breakers so that if you switch the power off at the box then both sides are isolated. 

 

In the UK the supply is one live side at 240v and one neutral which is held a few volts different (can't remember whether it's + or -) from earth/ground.  In no way should neutral and earth be confused or considered the same.  However switches should isolate the live side thus making the appliance safe.  If memory serves me, a white cable indicates a switched live.

 

It has been common practice in the PH to wire 110v appliances between one of the two 127v phases and an earth/ground.  If the earth/ground is not too good then the appliance will perform badly and because the voltage is greater than the appliance rating there is always a danger of it burning out (even for 120v appliances).

 

I am told by electrical engineers that it is not custom and practice to include an earth/ground if the power supply is overhead whereas if underground (e.g. UK) then an earth/ground is usually included.  I was horrified to observe that when MERALCO installed a supply to a new local housing development the cables were uninsulated and strung on posts along our village streets.  A typhoon that causes a post to fall means that live, uninsulated cables will be across the road.  I don't want to drive into one!

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trthebees

 

It's nothing to do with the fittings.  In my (limited) experience the PH provides a two-phase, 127v supply - 127 x sq. rt 3 = 220v.  Both sides of the circuit to a 220v light bulb will be live and the switch only isolates one of them to break the circuit; so one side, which may be the thread, remains live.  Only recently has the PH stocked and sold ganged circuit breakers so that if you switch the power off at the box then both sides are isolated.    In the UK the supply is one live side at 240v and one neutral which is held a few volts different (can't remember whether it's + or -) from earth/ground.  In no way should neutral and earth be confused or considered the same.  However switches should isolate the live side thus making the appliance safe.  If memory serves me, a white cable indicates a switched live.  

 

I reckon I'll get told off for talking too much about the UK wiring. But it's an interesting comparison.

 

On the first point...receptacles in the Philippines...unfortunately in this far province town there are some very cheap light fittings sold which do not completely shroud the screw part when screwed in. Considering that many lights round here are plugged in when required rather than fixed wiring, being Cebeco we can have 230V exposed, depending which way the plug is put in.

 

Re switched live in the UK. Going back over the years is probably confusing as trade practice and cable colours for three core and earth seemed to vary. Yellow seems to have been used for switched live, probably as an adaptation of 3-phase cable. There was some use of twin red and earth for light switches, but that just seemed more confusing as to which was the primary. Just about the only common practice appeared to have been the use of red (now brown) sleeving for the switched live. The following link appears to be a sound definition of current practice.

http://www.assentbc.co.uk/techlib/fixedwiringcolours.pdf

 

Re neutral voltage. A fascinating one...well, to me it is. I'll go back to the UK in a bit, and when I'm there check the neutral to earth voltage at 3 a.m. As my area is largely residential, I'll check again at a likely peak time....kettles on in the morning, Sunday roast time etc. All that returning current is likely to produce a few volts on the neutral, and I think I know our substation distance. Of course, you're right that no way should domestic earth and neutral be connected. If, say, you've 5V neutral at peak, connect the earth to the neutral and you'll have the neighbours neutral running through your link until enough current flows to give a resistance....probably thermally caused...equivalent to 5V. One smoky distribution panel.

 

For the last point, the same applies here. If annoying tingles occur (as does my computer case), or just for safety the metal case of the fridge should be earthed, I'll emphasise again what's been said already, it's essential that any earthing is entirely independent of any service wiring, line or neutral. Even here, where we have a Cebeco rod outside at the meter, I would never connect an appliance earth to that. Too risky that it's not 100%, and a transformer fault or overhead line fault could liven it.

 

Considering that metal casings are common here, and our GE fridge came with an earth wire attached, I'm a bit surprised that  the likes of condo buildings don't provide an independent earth terminal at each units distribution panel for use as required.

 

I'm not an expert by any means, so comments and criticisms are welcome.

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In my (limited) experience the PH provides a two-phase, 127v supply - 127 x sq. rt 3 = 220v.

 

Do you have any references to any system in the philippines being like that ???

 

On cebu island 2 systems are used

 

VECO    split phase pole transformer with center tap grounded, 2 hot 110-120 v 180 degrees out of phase = 220-240 volt ac

 

CEBECO 1, 2 and 3    220-240 v hot  and neutral, neutral grounded at pole transformer

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RogerDat

Greetings! Well, I hooked up the 12VDC circuit with 1-3, 3-1,0 load,2nd 0 source. It worked.

So 1-1, 3-3,1-3,3-1 all work. 1st 0 load, 2nd 0 source.

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Headshot

Greetings! Well, I hooked up the 12VDC circuit with 1-3, 3-1,0 load,2nd 0 source. It worked.

So 1-1, 3-3,1-3,3-1 all work. 1st 0 load, 2nd 0 source.

Just like I said...

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Hi Woolfe: F-----g hell.  Meralco in Manila is as I describe and I assumed other companies supplied similar since the three-phase 127 v (or as my one-time boss called it, the 380 v supply) is almost a de facto international standard.  180 phase? Love to see the windings - doesn't it vibrate a little?

Edited by GoHuk
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Seems  that you do not know much about power distribution in  USA & Canada

 

Schematic of pole transformer used in USA

 

same used in VECO Cebu except that neutral is not going to the house

 

Also attached a pictures of pole transformer

as used in VECO cebu distribution area

post-6705-0-33850300-1360062154_thumb.jpg

post-6705-0-04044000-1360062394_thumb.jpg

post-6705-0-91420600-1360062437_thumb.jpg

Edited by Woolf
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SkyMan

 

I assumed other companies supplied similar since the three-phase 127 v (or as my one-time boss called it, the 380 v supply) is almost a de facto international standard.

The defacto international standard is that there is no standard whatsoever.
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