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Runian

Passive aircon

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Runian

It looked like it needed it's own tread.

 

Now I have looked into this before cos I want to use geothermal cooling of my future residence. I am a tiny green buff ;) In my search for a aforementioned way of cooling, using groundwater was never mentioned, so I will not say good or bad. But I'll give some thought on it lower down.

 

I found 2 "viable" ways of using the ground as a cooler . #1 when building a new house dig a basement that is not meant for storage but as a cooling medium. The basement need to be about 1,5-2 meters deep under your house. In the centre of this you put a 1 meter high rectangular cube, that u fill with dirt (can be solid concrete if u want) and put a lid of concrete over to seal it. Now u circulate the indoor air through this room. Maybe this is a bad idea in a high humidity place like Ph as the moisture would settle in a humongous Petri-dish under your house, lighting the room with strong UV light will lightly keep it sterile though and you'll get some free fresh water.

 

The 2nd way is to sink several holes and make a loop of copper piping that you put down the holes, and fill them (the holes) with concrete. Now u can send the cooling liquid from you AC down this loop to pre cool before entering your AC compressor, or you can depending on how many holes u sunk use the cooling medium directly in some way. Now how deep these holes need to be I cant say, there is this myth that only 4 meters down the temperature is the same all over the world, well that is just a myth. Here in Norway I think u only need a 3 meter hole to hit stable cool temp. in Ph I am guessing 6 meters min. I'd sink a 12 m hole and take the temperature in increments to test.

 

The problem I see in circulating ground water is the return end of the project. Not only do u have to pump the water up, you also have to push it back down. Now this is a question of geology and if the aqua fur in your place is in sandstone, or like the Ukutan peninsula and some place like that, with underground limestone caverns holding free flowing water. If the underground water supply is in sandstone you need to push it back down cos the amount of water u need is higher then normal presure can defuse into the sandstone. This also opens up the question of how fast the water is able to flow into your well and if the high flow rate will soon clog up your borehole with loosened sand.

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SkyMan

I always wished I had thought of this option when I build my last house in Ohio. The house had a poured basement and I always wondered about laying a pattern of plastic pipe out on the ground before the basement floor was poured to pump water through for cooling. That basement waas always the coolest place in the house and never minded working down there even in the middle of summer. I did get some cooling benefit in the summer though. If it got warm upstairs my first option was to just turn on the furnace fan and that brought all the cool basement air up into the house often negating the need for AC.

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Jess Bartone
The 2nd way is to sink several holes and make a loop of copper piping that you put down the holes, and fill them (the holes) with concrete. Now u can send the cooling liquid from you AC down this loop to pre cool before entering your AC compressor

 

This is a great idea, not only would it cost less in electricity to run, it would also increase efficiency dramatically (same thing I s'pose), and lengthen the overall life of the aircon unit. The only downside would be the amount of R12 coolant it would take to fill all the pipes, but a small price to pay in the long run.

thumbs_up.gif

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acman

You would not use R12!

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Jess Bartone

You would not use R12!

 

 

well... elaborate, if you will, I'm not up with the latest coolant, they lost me when freon was bannedsurrender.gif

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Kahuna

I think the OP was going to use water as the active coolant in the piping[closed system] and run it thru the underground[either the basement with well idea or piping thruout the ground and use that as the "heat exchanger".]

Maybe to add to the "green-thinking" of this why not add a windmill of sorts to pump the water thru?

Or have I misunderstood this?Is this the idea?

I'm not sure what sort of "radiator" in the house would be appropiate.If you setup piping thruout the house the tubing would have to be run along the top of every room since "cold" air travels down.[copper tubing with radiator fins along on it with a way to catch the condensation and run that into something might be an idea.]Maybe set up a fan run with the same windmill used for pumping the water could be added?

A large underground area or the bottom of a large pond,lake or seabed for heat exchanging would have to be involved cause with the high heat there a smaller system would become useless as soon as the temps even out or become too close to each other after use.

Edited by Kahuna

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Runian

I think the OP was going to use water as the active coolant in the piping[closed system] and run it thru the underground[either the basement with well idea or piping thruout the ground and use that as the "heat exchanger".]

Maybe to add to the "green-thinking" of this why not add a windmill of sorts to pump the water thru?

Or have I misunderstood this?Is this the idea?

I'm not sure what sort of "radiator" in the house would be appropiate.If you setup piping thruout the house the tubing would have to be run along the top of every room since "cold" air travels down.[copper tubing with radiator fins along on it with a way to catch the condensation and run that into something might be an idea.]Maybe set up a fan run with the same windmill used for pumping the water could be added?

A large underground area or the bottom of a large pond,lake or seabed for heat exchanging would have to be involved cause with the high heat there a smaller system would become useless as soon as the temps even out or become too close to each other after use.

 

The idea is that at x amount of meters below the ground the temperature is aprox. +10 two12 Deg.C (55ish F) all year, and using that depth as a heat sink. The green thing from this is that you use a passive source to cool your rooms, negating or lowering your need for power to do that work.

 

Pulling a system on how to use this from the top of my head, I end up with this: take the inside fan and radiator from a two part AC. Sink 5

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Kahuna

I think the OP was going to use water as the active coolant in the piping[closed system] and run it thru the underground[either the basement with well idea or piping thruout the ground and use that as the "heat exchanger".]

Maybe to add to the "green-thinking" of this why not add a windmill of sorts to pump the water thru?

Or have I misunderstood this?Is this the idea?

I'm not sure what sort of "radiator" in the house would be appropiate.If you setup piping thruout the house the tubing would have to be run along the top of every room since "cold" air travels down.[copper tubing with radiator fins along on it with a way to catch the condensation and run that into something might be an idea.]Maybe set up a fan run with the same windmill used for pumping the water could be added?

A large underground area or the bottom of a large pond,lake or seabed for heat exchanging would have to be involved cause with the high heat there a smaller system would become useless as soon as the temps even out or become too close to each other after use.

 

The idea is that at x amount of meters below the ground the temperature is aprox. +10 two12 Deg.C (55ish F) all year, and using that depth as a heat sink. The green thing from this is that you use a passive source to cool your rooms, negating or lowering your need for power to do that work.

 

Pulling a system on how to use this from the top of my head, I end up with this: take the inside fan and radiator from a two part AC. Sink 5

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Jim Sibbick

I think the OP was going to use water as the active coolant in the piping[closed system] and run it thru the underground[either the basement with well idea or piping thruout the ground and use that as the "heat exchanger".]

Maybe to add to the "green-thinking" of this why not add a windmill of sorts to pump the water thru?

Or have I misunderstood this?Is this the idea?

I'm not sure what sort of "radiator" in the house would be appropiate.If you setup piping thruout the house the tubing would have to be run along the top of every room since "cold" air travels down.[copper tubing with radiator fins along on it with a way to catch the condensation and run that into something might be an idea.]Maybe set up a fan run with the same windmill used for pumping the water could be added?

A large underground area or the bottom of a large pond,lake or seabed for heat exchanging would have to be involved cause with the high heat there a smaller system would become useless as soon as the temps even out or become too close to each other after use.

 

The idea is that at x amount of meters below the ground the temperature is aprox. +10 two12 Deg.C (55ish F) all year, and using that depth as a heat sink. The green thing from this is that you use a passive source to cool your rooms, negating or lowering your need for power to do that work.

 

Pulling a system on how to use this from the top of my head, I end up with this: take the inside fan and radiator from a two part AC. Sink 5

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Runian

I think the OP was going to use water as the active coolant in the piping[closed system] and run it thru the underground[either the basement with well idea or piping thruout the ground and use that as the "heat exchanger".]

Maybe to add to the "green-thinking" of this why not add a windmill of sorts to pump the water thru?

Or have I misunderstood this?Is this the idea?

I'm not sure what sort of "radiator" in the house would be appropiate.If you setup piping thruout the house the tubing would have to be run along the top of every room since "cold" air travels down.[copper tubing with radiator fins along on it with a way to catch the condensation and run that into something might be an idea.]Maybe set up a fan run with the same windmill used for pumping the water could be added?

A large underground area or the bottom of a large pond,lake or seabed for heat exchanging would have to be involved cause with the high heat there a smaller system would become useless as soon as the temps even out or become too close to each other after use.

 

The idea is that at x amount of meters below the ground the temperature is aprox. +10 two12 Deg.C (55ish F) all year, and using that depth as a heat sink. The green thing from this is that you use a passive source to cool your rooms, negating or lowering your need for power to do that work.

 

Pulling a system on how to use this from the top of my head, I end up with this: take the inside fan and radiator from a two part AC. Sink 5

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sperry

I think the OP was going to use water as the active coolant in the piping[closed system] and run it thru the underground[either the basement with well idea or piping thruout the ground and use that as the "heat exchanger".]

Maybe to add to the "green-thinking" of this why not add a windmill of sorts to pump the water thru?

Or have I misunderstood this?Is this the idea?

I'm not sure what sort of "radiator" in the house would be appropiate.If you setup piping thruout the house the tubing would have to be run along the top of every room since "cold" air travels down.[copper tubing with radiator fins along on it with a way to catch the condensation and run that into something might be an idea.]Maybe set up a fan run with the same windmill used for pumping the water could be added?

A large underground area or the bottom of a large pond,lake or seabed for heat exchanging would have to be involved cause with the high heat there a smaller system would become useless as soon as the temps even out or become too close to each other after use.

 

The idea is that at x amount of meters below the ground the temperature is aprox. +10 two12 Deg.C (55ish F) all year, and using that depth as a heat sink. The green thing from this is that you use a passive source to cool your rooms, negating or lowering your need for power to do that work.

 

Pulling a system on how to use this from the top of my head, I end up with this: take the inside fan and radiator from a two part AC. Sink 5

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fredanna

UNfortunately with the constant heat and humidity there, unless you have a house on a hilltop or mountaintop, you will need good old air conditoning, with whatever gas they use as the refrigerant.

 

In Arizona (USA) before the heat and humid days start, you can use a "swamp cooler" where the humidity is so low that evaporating water over a medium will cool a space and you would not need conventional A/C.

 

Fred

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Mik

Dig a hole in a hill and put your house in it.

 

rings3.jpg

 

.

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fredanna

Dig a hole in a hill and put your house in it.

 

rings3.jpg

 

.

 

That looks like the place where "Teletubbies" live.

 

I'm sure it's cool in there!

 

Fred

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Jess Bartone

Dig a hole in a hill and put your house in it.

 

rings3.jpg

 

.

 

That looks like the place where "Teletubbies" live.

 

I'm sure it's cool in there!

 

Fred

 

The Hobbits knew how to live! Underground is the ideal place because the temperature changes very little from season to season, and is easily cooled or heated if it does.

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fanboat

The portable swamp coolers cost is quite low...and will keep you plenty cool(3,000-8,000 each)

 

The portable floor fans cost 1100 peso...and work very well here.

 

I think the pay bacvk on the geothermal system will take years to pay off?

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fredanna

The portable swamp coolers cost is quite low...and will keep you plenty cool(3,000-8,000 each)

 

The portable floor fans cost 1100 peso...and work very well here.

 

I think the pay bacvk on the geothermal system will take years to pay off?

 

 

The swamp coolers run on evaporating water over a medium to give a cooling effect. The humidity is too high in the Philippines for this type of cooling. The same for geothermal. You would have to dig verty very deep to get cold water.

The temp and humidity are extremely high ( The Tropics ) for any trick cooling technologies to work. That's why there is electrical shortages and "rolling blackouts" in the Phils.

 

Fred

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fanboat

The portable swamp coolers cost is quite low...and will keep you plenty cool(3,000-8,000 each)

 

The portable floor fans cost 1100 peso...and work very well here.

 

I think the pay bacvk on the geothermal system will take years to pay off?

 

 

The swamp coolers run on evaporating water over a medium to give a cooling effect. The humidity is too high in the Philippines for this type of cooling. The same for geothermal. You would have to dig verty very deep to get cold water.

The temp and humidity are extremely high ( The Tropics ) for any trick cooling technologies to work. That's why there is electrical shortages and "rolling blackouts" in the Phils.

 

Fred

 

I live here....i use a fan 24/7....a swamp cooler works even better...ask tim potter...or patrick...or all the other guys that use them

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Runian

The portable swamp coolers cost is quite low...and will keep you plenty cool(3,000-8,000 each)

 

The portable floor fans cost 1100 peso...and work very well here.

 

I think the pay bacvk on the geothermal system will take years to pay off?

 

 

The swamp coolers run on evaporating water over a medium to give a cooling effect. The humidity is too high in the Philippines for this type of cooling. The same for geothermal. You would have to dig verty very deep to get cold water.

The temp and humidity are extremely high ( The Tropics ) for any trick cooling technologies to work. That's why there is electrical shortages and "rolling blackouts" in the Phils.

 

Fred

 

Stick your hand under a tap from a ground water well and I think you will find it pretty cool, and much lower temp. then the daily middle temperature. Now do you know how far down u have to go to actually reach that temp. ? Coz this u have to know to claim it wont work.

 

Please: if some1 have well water and read this, and also posses a thermometer can u please check the temp. and post it here.( I am guessing it is about 55 F (out on a limb here :banghead:)) remember to let the tap run a bit to cool down the piping. And also how deep is the well and do you know how much it cost to drill, and what is the diameter of the bore hole . ?? any info is better then the 0 info I have :)

 

Reason for rolling blackouts is simple and it all connects up like this . Lack of planning nationally leads to lack of planning locally leads to two high power consumption, coz of lack of planing.

 

( I never remember the diff of : to, too and two ) :(

Edited by Runian

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richard90027

You would not use R12!

 

 

well... elaborate, if you will, I'm not up with the latest coolant, they lost me when freon was bannedsurrender.gif

R-12 was banned years ago worldwide. You may still find a few AC units charged with R-12 but the newer units will most likely be using R-22 or R-134a which is a refrigerant blend.

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fanboat

The evap cooler runs best with ice cubes and water mix.

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lazydays

Something you see in Thailand,but i've not yet seen here.

No glass in the windows,just covered with metal mesh (insect proof) so you nearly always have a breeze thro the house.

Just a thought.

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