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Mr. J E Pierce

Hello,

As my wife and I are starting construction of our Homestead (Tunga MoalBoal/ Alcantra), I am trying to find 4 inch PVC Pipe (blue) to use as a well casement. we are still digging the well, and are not sure of the final amount (feet). The well digger is estimating 100 ft. I hit a couple of the larger Hardware store in Cebu City, but no one seems to have the 4 " blue PVC, just the sanitary 4" orange pvc. Does anyone have a name and number to a supplier of the 4" Blue PVC PIPE?

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Dafey

Hello Mr. Pierce,

Welcome to the forum. 

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to_dave007
Posted (edited)

I use only Atlanta PVC here at my place (including well) and shop mostly at Cebu Atlantic Hardware, with several outlets in city.  Years ago, I called Atlanta in Manila and asked them who is their #1 distributor in Cebu..  Cebu Atlantic was who they pointed me to. One thing I like about Cebu Atlantic is that they can do store-to-store stock check that's been pretty reliable.  Another is that their distribution warehouse on Happy Valley Drive off V Rama has yet to disappoint me with a "sorry no stock" message.  But I have no idea if they carry the product you want (see below). 

The problem you are having is because Atlanta (and I assume it's competitors as well) do not offer 4" PVC in their domestic plumbing product line.  You can see from Atlanta brochure (download at http://atlanta.ph/products/atlanta-blue-house) for domestic in-house plumbing that their max size is 2".  If you want 4" blue then you must go to their municipal water distribution product line (http://atlanta.ph/products/atlanta-watermain).  As you can imagine.. the watermain product is likely not available at retail..  as it's offered primarily to municipalities.

My deep well (and many others) use the standard Atlanta domestic plumbing line..  with jet pump. I think mine is 2" casement with 1-1/4" inner pipe.  Mine goes down about 60 feet  I assume you are intending to use submersible pump.  Check with LINC member Skyman..  I THINK he has submersible as well. 

I would expect that any well contractor who is willing to drill for 4" casement should also be able to direct you to source for the casement pipes.

Edited by to_dave007
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SkyMan
7 hours ago, Mr. J E Pierce said:

Hello,

As my wife and I are starting construction of our Homestead (Tunga MoalBoal/ Alcantra), I am trying to find 4 inch PVC Pipe (blue) to use as a well casement. we are still digging the well, and are not sure of the final amount (feet). The well digger is estimating 100 ft. I hit a couple of the larger Hardware store in Cebu City, but no one seems to have the 4 " blue PVC, just the sanitary 4" orange pvc. Does anyone have a name and number to a supplier of the 4" Blue PVC PIPE?

I wanted to use PVC casing and found a supplier of really good quality 4" PVC at a place in Lapux2 (I think).  The driller advised against it though because the drill bit used was only 4" so the pipe OD would be a bit larger and the couplings larger still.  That could cause the PVC to break being pounded into the shaft.  Also, a percussion drill doesn't necessarily drill a straight hole and the PVC could bend around and the pump could get stuck.  My well ended up being more like 200ft and for casement I ended up using 4" Eagle Brand Schedule 40 GI pipe.  I slotted the bottom length and cut all the threaded ends off with a plasma cutter but an angle grinder will do as well.  Then the drill rig was used to raise the lengths for the welder.  There was a fair amount of pounding to get the casing down to the bottom.  Pump slid down no problem. 

At 100ft you could still use a jet pump as I think they are ok to 150ft but I have heard that over 100ft there may be some chance of losing prime.  An advantage of the submersible is that you don't need to hear the pump and also you can get a constant pressure system which is a bit more expensive but very nice.  I have no holding tank on the surface or additional surface pump to provide pressure yet I have a constant 45PSI and that's the lowest setting.

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Ozepete

Yes and the submersibles are a lot more power efficient. Also if using the PVC type casing it is best to have the submersible switched on / off via a 3 phase contactor so  that the actives, neutral and EARTH wires can all be disconnect when off. We lost one pump due to electronic erosion caused by the pump acting as the preferred earth 100% of the time.

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Mr. J E Pierce
On ‎7‎/‎14‎/‎2019 at 5:00 PM, Dafey said:

Hello Mr. Pierce,

Welcome to the forum. 

thank you

 

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Mr. J E Pierce
On ‎7‎/‎14‎/‎2019 at 8:17 PM, SkyMan said:

I wanted to use PVC casing and found a supplier of really good quality 4" PVC at a place in Lapux2 (I think).  The driller advised against it though because the drill bit used was only 4" so the pipe OD would be a bit larger and the couplings larger still.  That could cause the PVC to break being pounded into the shaft.  Also, a percussion drill doesn't necessarily drill a straight hole and the PVC could bend around and the pump could get stuck.  My well ended up being more like 200ft and for casement I ended up using 4" Eagle Brand Schedule 40 GI pipe.  I slotted the bottom length and cut all the threaded ends off with a plasma cutter but an angle grinder will do as well.  Then the drill rig was used to raise the lengths for the welder.  There was a fair amount of pounding to get the casing down to the bottom.  Pump slid down no problem. 

At 100ft you could still use a jet pump as I think they are ok to 150ft but I have heard that over 100ft there may be some chance of losing prime.  An advantage of the submersible is that you don't need to hear the pump and also you can get a constant pressure system which is a bit more expensive but very nice.  I have no holding tank on the surface or additional surface pump to provide pressure yet I have a constant 45PSI and that's the lowest setting.

Thank you SKYMAN. I was also concerned about the hole size and the issue with the couplings. So I measured the drill bit before the driller started to drill. it was 6 1/4 inches in diameter.  It is my intent to use a submersible pump. Since I am a Master Electrician, I have been looking at some solar pump systems available her in the US. I would just need to pick up the solar panels in Cebu City. it is my plan to pump the water up to a 300ml holding tank, then through some filters to elevated (50ft) 1000 ml holding tank.

 

 

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Mr. J E Pierce
On ‎7‎/‎14‎/‎2019 at 8:32 PM, Ozepete said:

Yes and the submersibles are a lot more power efficient. Also if using the PVC type casing it is best to have the submersible switched on / off via a 3 phase contactor so  that the actives, neutral and EARTH wires can all be disconnect when off. We lost one pump due to electronic erosion caused by the pump acting as the preferred earth 100% of the time.

Thanks OZEPETE, that is a good idea, one I hadn't thought of..... I am a huge advocate of a strong grounding (earth) system.

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SkyMan
5 hours ago, Mr. J E Pierce said:

Since I am a Master Electrician, I have been looking at some solar pump systems available her in the US. I would just need to pick up the solar panels in Cebu City. it is my plan to pump the water up to a 300ml holding tank, then through some filters to elevated (50ft) 1000 ml holding tank.

It may not be the best place to get them but All-Batteries sells panels.  Any pump system can be run with solar if the solar is big enough to handle it.  I am thinking the constant pressure system would be a better choice than regular pumping system since the pump is controlled via 3 phase.  No holding tanks or towers needed for that but you might want a backup power supply or just realize that when the power is out, the water will be too.  We don't have very long blackouts so no problem and you can use bottled water for an emergency shower if you need to.

Why the double holding tank?  The submersible can pump up to the tower and then you can filter from there with gravity pressure.  For the surface tank you'd need another pump to fill the tank on the tower.

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Ozepete

Mr. Pierce...  For what its worth you mention irrigating an area of vines so you are talking some serious water. We now have 20k sq meters here mostly under garden. Our bore was drilled to 45 meters x 120mm about six years ago. (Drilled and cased in one day by Strathy drillers!) Tired of paying well over a thousand + dollars for 'German made'  bore pumps, my Scottish heritage steered me to a Chinese made similar 2.5Kw 14 stage 5500 lt / hr at Au$240.   This pump lasted over a year until electrolysis (electronic erosion) damaged it but no fault of the pump as the bore is next to our workshop where there are lots of weird electrical happenings! So we bought another and a spare. That second Chinese pump is still working perfectly since we addressed the earth leakage problem We pump over 5000 Lt / hr and in summer it runs about 50% duty cycle.  

I initially investigated DC pumps (Nearly all 'DC motor items actually have a Motor Driver Module that invert DC to AC then split into 3 phases so they are actually 3 Phase AC, and then the better ones have soft start via frequency ramp up) Also the pump cost penalty made using an AC pump via a pure sine wave inverter a better proposition if power supply is to be solar.  JMO

 

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TimL

Maybe try cebuchampionhardware.com in Kasambagan. 

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to_dave007
6 hours ago, Mr. J E Pierce said:

 it is my plan to pump the water up to a 300ml holding tank, then through some filters to elevated (50ft) 1000 ml holding tank.

I know I'm nit picking..  but I assume 300ml and 1000 ml is a typo..  and should be 300L and 1000L

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cookie47
2 hours ago, Ozepete said:

That second Chinese pump

I'd like to support that decision. 

My last foray in Australia was on a cattle station in Western Australia,prior to settling in the Philippines. 

We had a windmill bore converted  to "Chinese" submersible pump and solar panels (comes as a kit with Pump, controller, and panels. Darn thing didn't miss a beat and probably still going today. 

I can't tell you the kw, or capacities but was quite effective during daylight hours and if everything went well only a couple of hours to fit. No back up batteries. 

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Mr. J E Pierce
21 hours ago, SkyMan said:

It may not be the best place to get them but All-Batteries sells panels.  Any pump system can be run with solar if the solar is big enough to handle it.  I am thinking the constant pressure system would be a better choice than regular pumping system since the pump is controlled via 3 phase.  No holding tanks or towers needed for that but you might want a backup power supply or just realize that when the power is out, the water will be too.  We don't have very long blackouts so no problem and you can use bottled water for an emergency shower if you need to.

Why the double holding tank?  The submersible can pump up to the tower and then you can filter from there with gravity pressure.  For the surface tank you'd need another pump to fill the tank on the tower.

Not Sure why the double holding tanks, just seems like a good idea. It was an idea to be able to hold un filtered water for the less desired watering needs like irrigation.

 

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Mr. J E Pierce
20 hours ago, Ozepete said:

Mr. Pierce...  For what its worth you mention irrigating an area of vines so you are talking some serious water. We now have 20k sq meters here mostly under garden. Our bore was drilled to 45 meters x 120mm about six years ago. (Drilled and cased in one day by Strathy drillers!) Tired of paying well over a thousand + dollars for 'German made'  bore pumps, my Scottish heritage steered me to a Chinese made similar 2.5Kw 14 stage 5500 lt / hr at Au$240.   This pump lasted over a year until electrolysis (electronic erosion) damaged it but no fault of the pump as the bore is next to our workshop where there are lots of weird electrical happenings! So we bought another and a spare. That second Chinese pump is still working perfectly since we addressed the earth leakage problem We pump over 5000 Lt / hr and in summer it runs about 50% duty cycle.  

I initially investigated DC pumps (Nearly all 'DC motor items actually have a Motor Driver Module that invert DC to AC then split into 3 phases so they are actually 3 Phase AC, and then the better ones have soft start via frequency ramp up) Also the pump cost penalty made using an AC pump via a pure sine wave inverter a better proposition if power supply is to be solar.  JMO

 

Thanks for your Share, I am just looking at my options. There are A few companies out their now that have some really nice solar powered submersible pumps.

I am confused on your second paragraph, what I am looking at are tru DC motors (positive and Negative) I am well aware of how to convert DC to AC and Vice Versa.

I appreciate you mentioning who drilled your Bore, Are you on Cebu Island, and are you on the south or north part. I am not familiar with all the towns and Provinces of Cebu

17 hours ago, cookie47 said:

I'd like to support that decision. 

My last foray in Australia was on a cattle station in Western Australia,prior to settling in the Philippines. 

We had a windmill bore converted  to "Chinese" submersible pump and solar panels (comes as a kit with Pump, controller, and panels. Darn thing didn't miss a beat and probably still going today. 

I can't tell you the kw, or capacities but was quite effective during daylight hours and if everything went well only a couple of hours to fit. No back up batteries. 

Thanks for the suggestion, That is pretty much the type I am looking at. No batteries

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