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GTevenier

Philippines Real estate confusion

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Davaoeno
14 hours ago, GTevenier said:

So, the airport is not a factor that drives the prices up,

I see no evidence on which anyone could reach that conclusion.

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fred42
15 hours ago, GTevenier said:

So, the airport is not a factor that drives the prices up


The promise of the new airport over the last 15 years has seen the prices and development rise to what you can see today.

 

15 hours ago, GTevenier said:

Who wants to buy land if cant have a title?

You would be surprised how much tax dec land is being sold here on a weekly basis regardless of the risks involved.
Titled land will go at premium prices!

 

 

15 hours ago, GTevenier said:

Liquido has a point also: Foreigner,OFW or Seaman money is pouring in..


Yeah true,but just lately we are seeing more and more Chinese businessmen building larger and larger hotel complexes. 
 

 

15 hours ago, GTevenier said:

And maybe sellers adjust the price to the galloping inflation, current and future? Or many of the sellers hired real estate agents that doubled the sale price?

Maybe!


The problem here is that as usual the Municipal local government are allowing huge development plans go ahead without all the necessary infrastructure... For instance,no waste water treatment plant on island.
Crazy.

 

Edited by fred42
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Headshot

There is no way that anybody can apply reason to the Philippine real estate market. First of all, there is no "market" because there is no MLS (Multiple Listing Service). Therefore, there is no way to compare similar properties the way you would in a typical real estate market. Because of this, sellers pull pricing out of thin air, mostly based on rumors they have heard about the amounts others have been selling their property (usually there is no truth to these rumors). There is no real way to advertise real estate, other than to list it with as many brokers as you can find. The reason for that is that brokers here don't generally share commissions with other brokers. In fact, they will do everything they can to screw others out of their commissions.

There are basically two systems of pricing. First, sellers who want to sell, but don't really need to sell, value their property as highly as possible (and they will seldom come down on pricing). You can negotiate all you want, but they will seldom come down on pricing. Second, there are those who may or may not want to sell, but need to sell because of some financial crisis in their lives. With the second group, you can usually negotiate a lower price as long as it doesn't drop down below what they they actually need to solve their financial crisis. Because there is no established market, there is no way to know whether or not you have gotten a good deal on a given property other than just gut feel.

Because of the unorganized market here, there is no easy way to buy or sell real estate. It can take years before a property sells, primarily because nobody knows it's for sale. It is mainly due to serendipity that buyers and sellers come together. It amazes me that some enterprising Filipinos haven't organized an MLS for this country. Maybe someday somebody will do that. It would certainly take a lot of the corruption out of the system. Of course, that is probably why it hasn't happened. From my limited experience with real estate here, it appears that those involved in real estate here make much of their money through corruption (cheating both the buyer and seller on price).

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Davaoeno
37 minutes ago, Headshot said:

There is no way that anybody can apply reason to the Philippine real estate market. First of all, there is no "market" because there is no MLS (Multiple Listing Service). Therefore, there is no way to compare similar properties the way you would in a typical real estate market. Because of this, sellers pull pricing out of thin air, mostly based on rumors they have heard about the amounts others have been selling their property (usually there is no truth to these rumors). There is no real way to advertise real estate, other than to list it with as many brokers as you can find. The reason for that is that brokers here don't generally share commissions with other brokers. In fact, they will do everything they can to screw others out of their commissions.

There are basically two systems of pricing. First, sellers who want to sell, but don't really need to sell, value their property as highly as possible (and they will seldom come down on pricing). You can negotiate all you want, but they will seldom come down on pricing. Second, there are those who may or may not want to sell, but need to sell because of some financial crisis in their lives. With the second group, you can usually negotiate a lower price as long as it doesn't drop down below what they they actually need to solve their financial crisis. Because there is no established market, there is no way to know whether or not you have gotten a good deal on a given property other than just gut feel.

Because of the unorganized market here, there is no easy way to buy or sell real estate. It can take years before a property sells, primarily because nobody knows it's for sale. It is mainly due to serendipity that buyers and sellers come together. It amazes me that some enterprising Filipinos haven't organized an MLS for this country. Maybe someday somebody will do that. It would certainly take a lot of the corruption out of the system. Of course, that is probably why it hasn't happened. From my limited experience with real estate here, it appears that those involved in real estate here make much of their money through corruption (cheating both the buyer and seller on 

 

Those are just details. I am too busy making  money In real estate dealings to pay any attention to them !

 

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maximian
1 hour ago, Headshot said:

From my limited experience with real estate here, it appears that those involved in real estate here make much of their money through corruption (cheating both the buyer and seller on price).

From my experience nearly everybody involved in real estate sales don't have a pot to piss in, as they usually end up getting very little from the seller or buyer. 

 

 

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GTevenier
2 hours ago, Headshot said:

There is no way that anybody can apply reason to the Philippine real estate market. First of all, there is no "market" because there is no MLS (Multiple Listing Service). Therefore, there is no way to compare similar properties the way you would in a typical real estate market. Because of this, sellers pull pricing out of thin air, mostly based on rumors they have heard about the amounts others have been selling their property (usually there is no truth to these rumors). There is no real way to advertise real estate, other than to list it with as many brokers as you can find. The reason for that is that brokers here don't generally share commissions with other brokers. In fact, they will do everything they can to screw others out of their commissions.

There are basically two systems of pricing. First, sellers who want to sell, but don't really need to sell, value their property as highly as possible (and they will seldom come down on pricing). You can negotiate all you want, but they will seldom come down on pricing. Second, there are those who may or may not want to sell, but need to sell because of some financial crisis in their lives. With the second group, you can usually negotiate a lower price as long as it doesn't drop down below what they they actually need to solve their financial crisis. Because there is no established market, there is no way to know whether or not you have gotten a good deal on a given property other than just gut feel.

Because of the unorganized market here, there is no easy way to buy or sell real estate. It can take years before a property sells, primarily because nobody knows it's for sale. It is mainly due to serendipity that buyers and sellers come together. It amazes me that some enterprising Filipinos haven't organized an MLS for this country. Maybe someday somebody will do that. It would certainly take a lot of the corruption out of the system. Of course, that is probably why it hasn't happened. From my limited experience with real estate here, it appears that those involved in real estate here make much of their money through corruption (cheating both the buyer and seller on price).

Nice shot headshot. Yesterday We visited a land in Dauis with a sign “for sale” and a cellphone number on to call. We did so, to be told by a RE person the land is 3000P. (Was 800 3 years ago on sale by the owner). 5000 sqm tax declaration land. We knew that no inheritance taxes were paid by the heirs of 3 generations, that may be in the range of half the price of the land more or less, but we can’t find out the exact amount. We asked the RE person who pays these taxes to be told is our responsibility together with the capital gains, documentary stamp Lawyer’s fee and application for title. Our estimate is that will cost double the selling price. No, we dont want to play with double deed of sale, one real and another for the BIR.

Neighbors helped us find the owner of the land, went to see him, he’s willing to sell it to us for 2000 sqm. We’re pushing hard for 1500 cash on signature, - provided all paper work is in order and all of the heirs agree, and none of them is a minor -  knowing that’s the price he will get from the RE agent.  We’ll see.

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GTevenier
2 hours ago, Davaoeno said:

Those are just details. I am too busy making  money In real estate dealings to pay any attention to them !

 

 

I thought the devil is always in the details, isn't it?

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smokey

Glad you found you heaven on earth where is it? Hope you dont find yourself in court for the next 25 years .... Tax.dec.   hummmm anyone can pay taxes on land even if its not theirs

Edited by smokey
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GTevenier
11 hours ago, smokey said:

Glad you found you heaven on earth where is it? Hope you dont find yourself in court for the next 25 years .... Tax.dec.   hummmm anyone can pay taxes on land even if its not theirs

A Filipino doctor from Cebu bought the land in 2000 for 300 pesos, started building in 2003. Around halfway of building the concrete structure, someone filed court papers that he’s one of the heirs left out of the deal asking the cancellation of the transaction and returning of the land to the previous owners, him and his relatives that is. The claimant said that at the time of the transaction he was a minor, his father was the heir but died, the mother of the minor needed a court order proving the sale was in the interest of the minor, then proceed to the signature. Instead, she chose to hide the fact from the buyer, and the deal was completed.

The doctor was willing to compensate the heir with the same amount as he paid to each of the 8 others. The claimant did not agree, arguing the calculation based on 300 pesos per sq.m was ridiculous and the real price of the land was 3000 per sq.m and should he accept the offer will be calculated at his number (3000) plus “a few extras”, not on the deed of sale. His lawyer advised the doctor to accept the deal and pay. He did so, but soon after the deal was closed he filled Estafa charges against the mother and the others for conspiracy to defraud him. The locals around told me that facing the risk to get jail time they returned half the money he paid and got another piece of land for free in exchange of dropping the charges. the doctor completed the construction of his house, end of the story, happily ever after.
I know of 2 other cases in the area, one “won” the case 10 years later, the other one abandoned it and left to the UK.

What is more worrisome is, according to Fred42, the DENR stopped  issuing titles. living the  sword of Damocles over your head for the rest of your life. but that’s another story, long to explain, don’t want to abuse the place.

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fred42
4 hours ago, GTevenier said:

What is more worrisome is, according to Fred42, the DENR stopped  issuing titles.

 

The document that I saw BTW mentioned Panglao..Not Dauis.
It also listed:
El nido,Palawan
Coron,Palawan and Siarigao.
 

Edited by fred42

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smokey
7 hours ago, GTevenier said:

A Filipino doctor from Cebu bought the land in 2000 for 300 pesos, started building in 2003. Around halfway of building the concrete structure, someone filed court papers that he’s one of the heirs left out of the deal asking the cancellation of the transaction and returning of the land to the previous owners, him and his relatives that is. The claimant said that at the time of the transaction he was a minor, his father was the heir but died, the mother of the minor needed a court order proving the sale was in the interest of the minor, then proceed to the signature. Instead, she chose to hide the fact from the buyer, and the deal was completed.

The doctor was willing to compensate the heir with the same amount as he paid to each of the 8 others. The claimant did not agree, arguing the calculation based on 300 pesos per sq.m was ridiculous and the real price of the land was 3000 per sq.m and should he accept the offer will be calculated at his number (3000) plus “a few extras”, not on the deed of sale. His lawyer advised the doctor to accept the deal and pay. He did so, but soon after the deal was closed he filled Estafa charges against the mother and the others for conspiracy to defraud him. The locals around told me that facing the risk to get jail time they returned half the money he paid and got another piece of land for free in exchange of dropping the charges. the doctor completed the construction of his house, end of the story, happily ever after.
I know of 2 other cases in the area, one “won” the case 10 years later, the other one abandoned it and left to the UK.

What is more worrisome is, according to Fred42, the DENR stopped  issuing titles. living the  sword of Damocles over your head for the rest of your life. but that’s another story, long to explain, don’t want to abuse the place.

We own tax dec properties or should say we are pretty sure one piece has records going back to 1887. Build at your own risk

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Jawny

We have several lots, none of which have a title in our possession.  Many reasons why, but basically, a tax declaration lot is adequate for us.  As an example, the first place we bought was a house and lot, part of a much larger titled property.  The house and lot had been in the possession of a single family for decades.  The heirs of the deceased owners sold the lot and house to us.  

Next to the house, on either side, there were dozens of other lots and houses, all part of the same titled land. If there was going to be any issue from the title holder or heirs, there would be dozens of families potentially losing their investment. Highly unlikely. 

We had considered buying land from a family nearby and spoke to some of the family.  Thankfully, they were quite honest about the conditions of sale.  The land they own, which is extensive, is all part of a single titled area.  If we bought some of it, the heirs livIng overseas might some day return and demand their entitlement. In effect, unless all heirs agreed, there was a risk of losing the investment. 

We opted to pass 

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GTevenier

Hello and good day. After looking at several lands in Dauis and Panglao decided to get out and look to the rural areas. For the joke, no rumors heard about building an airport there, but something bigger is coming: A bridge linking Bohol to Cebu that will trigger even higher prices. As for a titled land I think I should forget about it, out of 16 lands I visited only 3 were titled, not interested by the size and price I'll have to settle for a tax declaration something that requires an extremely careful examination of the history of the land. 

My investigation showed that very few cases turned to be a fiasco, most had a successful transition and obtained a title after a lengthy process. Of course, I'm not expecting from my lawyer to explain me all that, I do my home work on my own, concluding so far that the key words are DENR , Assesor's office and BIR. I know, the road will be bumpy, challenging and with surprises, but no money for titled land at outraged price. So, let's do it, I'll keep you posted of what happened, if interested.  

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to_dave007

Bought several adjoining Tax dec lots here in Tuburan more than 5 years ago, and finally, in 2019, after nearly 5 years effort and some considerable expense, I believe we are now less than 3 months from having registered title.  For us..  we would never have succeeded if we relied on attorneys and lawyers.  But we got LOTS of help from one honest and hard working lady (Lelit) here in town who knew the process.  And I have personally checked the authenticity of all BIR docs.. and will do the same with land titles docs.

Just one of a dozen stories..  we needed one death certificate for lady who died 20+ years ago.  To get it we needed date of death.  But none of her relatives could remember the exact date of death.  We were blocked..  until Lelit walked the graves at the cemetery to find the lady's grave. 

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HongKongPhooey
On 3/4/2019 at 4:51 PM, GTevenier said:

Hello and good day. After looking at several lands in Dauis and Panglao decided to get out and look to the rural areas. For the joke, no rumors heard about building an airport there, but something bigger is coming: A bridge linking Bohol to Cebu that will trigger even higher prices. As for a titled land I think I should forget about it,

Where you from GT? No offense but you’re starting to write like a Nigerian Prince that emails me frequently...

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