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Cebuano v Bisaya ...exactly the same or not.......

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The Cebuano (/sɛˈbwɑːn/) or Cebuan language (/sɛˈbən/ seh-BOO-ən),[1][5] also often referred to by most of its speakers simply as Bisaya  (English translation: "Visayan") - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cebuano_language

Looks like you were wrong about that OP, and if you really got three six-month extensions, post some pics of the three stamps. Then the rest of us can bring those pics to our BI office and educate them on what's possible in The Philippines.

 

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oztony

We are going to thrash this out here , and not in the visa extension thread , 

There are many differences between the 2 , which makes it obvious to the users of these dialects as to which island they come from.

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shadow
1 hour ago, oztony said:

We are going to thrash this out here , and not in the visa extension thread , 

There are many differences between the 2 , which makes it obvious to the users of these dialects as to which island they come from.

There are differences even on the same island. Negros, for instance, speaks two completely different languages, depending on whether you are on the right side or the left side. On the right side (Oriental) you can just go 50 KM north or south and there are differences in the Visayan. Cross the water to Cebu, and there are significantly more changes.

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SkyMan

When I mentioned some saying uwan and some ulan that was without leaving Cebu. My wife is from near Duma and when we visited Bacolod she mentioned she liked the way they talk there.

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Dafey
1 hour ago, shadow said:

There are differences even on the same island

There are 4 distinct different languages and horde of dialects on Leyte alone.  

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oztony

House in Cebu ....bay 

" "........in Negros ....balay...

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Salty Dog
7 minutes ago, oztony said:

House in Cebu ....bay 

" "........in Negros ....balay...

I never knew " "...... ment house...:biggrin_01:

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oztony

Nothing 

Cebuano ....wa ....way

Bisaya ....wala ....walay

Cebuano tend to drop the L in certain things ...

To my knowledge ...Cebuano is just in the Cebu area ....and everywhere else is their own take off of Bisaya ......

 

 

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oztony

@SkyMan  Your wife comes from a few k's down the road from my wife on Negros ...so their Bisaya would be identical ... you guy's have been in Cebu for many years now so would be in the box seat to recognise that there is differences between Cebuano and Bisaya...

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A_Simple_Man

This guy gives a good treatise on the subject:

http://www.binisaya.com/content/dialectology-cebuano-cebuano-bisaya-binisaya

While he acknowledges the many distinctions, he concludes:
 

Quote

In summary, Cebuano and Binisaya as a language and Cebuano and Bisaya as a people are interchangeable.

Here is the entire article in a spoiler for those who want to peruse it.

Spoiler

The Dialectology of Cebuano: Cebuano, Bisaya, Binisaya
litogo's pictureThu, 02/10/2011 - 11:03 — litogo
2. CEBUANO, BISAYA, BINISAYA
In common/everyday parlance, Bisaya is the term used to refer to Cebuano. Whenever a person or a language is called Bisaya (lang. Binisaya), it is a common notion or it would immediately refer to Cebuano despite the fact that there are many languages in the Visayas which in general are called Visayan or Binisaya. Is Bisaya any different from Cebuano? How do they differ?
               
This impression probably came about in 1948, when Cebuano speakers comprise one fourth of the Philippine population. This however had gone down to 22% in the 1995 Census and the result of the 2000 census is still debatable.
 
There are many languages categorized as Binisaya (Visayan)- Cebuano, Hiligaynon, Waray etc. They are separate languages because they are not mutually intelligible and that the syntax and morphology are different although they are of the same subgroup. Their speakers are called Bisaya. If in Aklanon, Hiligaynon, Kinaray-a and other languages in the Western Visayan region, it is pronounced with the stress on the penultima [bɪˈsʌjʌɁ] whereas in Cebuano, Surigaonon and other languages in the Eastern Visayas, it has the stress on the ultima [bɪsʌˈjʌɁ] (Zorc, 1975:6 [footnote]). The language is not exclusive to the Visayas islands since their extent includes that of Mindanao and other areas in Luzon. According to Alzina (Zorc 1975:9), the Visayan region before includes Masbate, Southern Sorsogon and the northeastern part of Mindanao or the Surigao peninsula. The inclusion of Surigao is further attested by an account of V. de Napoles.
 
This situation can be compared to that in Bicol. Bicol has four main groupings, each with its own set of languages but each grouping and each language is identified as Bicolano.
 
Bisaya, therefore, is a generic word. It is used like the word Filipino; Cebuanos are Filipino, Tagalogs are Filipino, Ilocanos are Filipino, but not all Filipinos are Cebuano, not all Filipinos are Tagalog, not all Filipinos are Ilocano. Similarly, not all Bisaya are Cebuano, not all Bisaya are Ilonggo, not all Bisaya are Waray, but the Cebuanos, Ilonggos, Warays are Bisaya. As used by a Cebuano, Bisaya is interchangeable with Cebuano. To someone in Bacolod, Bisaya is interchangeable with Ilonggo (Hiligaynon). To someone in Tacloban or Samar, Bisaya is interchangeable with Waray but Cebuano, Ilonggo and Waray are not interchangeable (Atty. Faelnar; personal communication). Another observation is that, for the people in the academe and non-Cebuano speakers, the language is called Cebuano but for the native speakers the language, it is called Binisaya. If the speakers want to speak the language, they would say MagBinisaya lang ta or Binisay-on lang nato ‘Let’s speak/talk in Binisaya’.
 
 The identity Bisaya is not exclusive to the Philippines because it also refers to some minority tribes in Sarawak, Brunei and Sabah. The discovery of Bisaya [bɪsʌˈjʌɁ] tribes there, as evidenced by articles from the Sarawak Museum Journal and the Sabah Society Journal (Zorc, 1975:55), stirred a flurry of studies on their relationship with the Philippine Bisaya and the origin of the Bisaya people. However, the Bisaya in Borneo belongs to the Dusunic group (Prentice 1970: 377, as quoted in Zorc 1975:56), whereas Philippine Bisaya is subgrouped under the Central Philippine languages. Also, the Sultan of Brunei was identified by Western writers as Bisaya (Dr. Tiu; p.c).
 
As to the origin of the word Bisaya, there are many possibilities, as quoted in Zorc (1975; 52-55). It is said to have an Indic or Austronesian origin. It may be derived from the Sanskrit vijaya ‘victory, victorious’; visaya ‘subject(s), dominion, territory, country, kingdom’; vaicya ‘third caste’ or sahaya ‘slave’. Another theory is that it came from vicara ‘thought, thinking’. This word is used for ‘speak’ in Banton (Bantuanon subgroup), Odionganon and Sibalenhon, in opposition to languages which use *sarita [sariˈtaɁ] like Tagalog salita. As for the Malayo-Polynesian etymology, it is proposed that there is an *-aya root which means ‘chap, person’ or *daya which means inland or upriver. Another theory involves the root *saˈyaɁ ‘happy, carefree’.
 
As to the difference between Binisaya and Bisaya, these are the definitions by Mr. Edgar Godin, Associate Editor of the Bisaya Magasin.
Bisaya – pungan (noun) – usa ka tawo kun linalang nga lumad sa Kabisay-an; katawhan sa Isla sa Kabisay-an; o natawo ug nanimuyo sa bisan diing dapit sa nasod o kalibotan kansang ginikanan kaliwat og Bisaya kun taga Kabisay-an og kagikan. (is a noun; a person native to the Visayas; born or living anywhere in the world whose parents are from the Visayas); therefore referring to the person
Binisaya – 1. pungan (noun) – lengguwahe o pinulongan sa katawhan sa Kabisay-an; 2. pungway (adjective) – iya sa o kalabot sa mga Bisaya, sama sa lihok, kinaiya, proseso o pamaagi, ubp. (noun: language by the people in the Visayas , 2. Adjective, those of the Visayans, i.e movement, ownership, processes etc. ); therefore referring to the language and those that are of the Visayan people.
 
Also, Binisaya serves as a cover term for different languages in the Visayas and their dialects in Mindanao and also some languages in Mindanao.
 
In summary, Cebuano and Binisaya as a language and Cebuano and Bisaya as a people are interchangeable.

 

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to_dave007

There is also the difference between deep visayan..  which is a more traditional visayan spoken most commonly now in the interior of the islands and provincial areas..  and more modern visayan which is more in the cities..  I understand that the abbreviations mentioned above tend to be more "urban" than provincial. 

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Freedvr72

My GF from a little mountain town in Mindanao,  Aurora, Zamboanga del sur  has explained many times to me that in the south, depending on the "tribe" that words can be very different,

 I wasn't aware of the differences just here in Cebu, let alone the islands in Visaya,  but I figurered there were. Her advice on learning was to learn Tagalog, since I already speak Spanish,  that Tagalog would come fast to me and I could use it to "get by, survive" until I learned her language,  bisaya....not to mention the younger generation text "jigimon" a very abbreviated version of bisaya and they speak it, kind of the little differences in America,  with someone from say Arkansas or even lousisana compaired to New York.  I dated a girl from Munich that would correct my "lazy American English" all the time, "ya"'ll gunna head out?" To a person who English is 2nd language that may be confusing, this applies I'm sure to most languages. Sorry for long post,  but to say Cebuana, and bisyana is the same, is incorrect. It's actually not even logical to assume any language is the same in every region as I pointed out, even in my home country regions use different words and construct sentences different,  but here they are legitimately different. Some tribes in the south speak a version that's very different, so much that locals don't even understand

 But hey,  therewill always be the "stereotype" people, the ones that claim white men can't jump, black men can't swim,  Asians can't drive cars.....sterotyping isn't always the case, I only thought their were 2 languages here before arrival, we all have a learning curve, to give him benefit of the doubt, maybe he meant no offense and honestly did not know, but it makes one wonder...if he didn't know...why so adimant,  why so obsessed with proving he was right, or was is it obsession proving another wrong that makes him happy? But the passion and ferver in which he passive aggressively makes his point with condescending overtones, confrontational remarks, make me wonder if he even cares, if this whole thing was about discrediting another person.

Maybe not, maybe he is a super good guy that has a thirst for deeper understanding, but then, when discovering he was wrong,  and so many on here know so much about the differences, why not ask about them? Why not use their knowledge to soak up that eager mind? Hmmm?

for future new people like myself,  put on your thick skin and just ignore if he slips and slides past the forums rules to indirectly call you a liar, I made the mistake of taking him seriously...because most people here are genuinely interested,  good people, and quite helpful, so he can catch a newbie off guard by blending in with all the great people here, just don't take anything personal. I apologize for going off topic.

Big time respect to the mods on here, splitting this post was genius. Advice to newbies, the moderators will help you out, just flow with it,  they are savy, and know exactly what's going on. I learned the hard way, still a newbie myself. Oh, double check spell check!! Hahaha,  that might lead to a off topic duel with him that will stop the post from bearing fruit. Or...just pretend that he doesn't exist if he starts the "copy and paste" thing by removing one sentence from OP and twisting it. But always give each new post a fresh chance, we all deserve one...or 2 or 3...chuckles*

Edited by Freedvr72

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SkyMan
15 hours ago, to_dave007 said:

There is also the difference between deep visayan..  which is a more traditional visayan spoken most commonly now in the interior of the islands and provincial areas..  and more modern visayan which is more in the cities..  I understand that the abbreviations mentioned above tend to be more "urban" than provincial. 

Yes, deep visayan is more the true visa without outside influence.  You probably know grandparents are lolo and lola but those are from Spanish.  The real word for grandparent is apohan.  Grandchild is apo.  In fact, the only Visayan words I know with a gender are inahan, amahan.  Mother and father,

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Freedvr72
12 minutes ago, SkyMan said:

Yes, deep visayan is more the true visa without outside influence.  You probably know grandparents are lolo and lola but those are from Spanish.  The real word for grandparent is apohan.  Grandchild is apo.  In fact, the only Visayan words I know with a gender are inahan, amahan.  Mother and father,

My GF just read this and asked me to reply,  with a THANK YOU!! Not that you need any validation, but she really liked that point you made,  while she speaks more Spanish influence to me, however her native tounge is "deep" with very little to no Spanish influence. 

Edited by Freedvr72

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BossHog

The biggest variation I've noticed in vocabulary is in describing flora and fauna. Birds,  trees, and medicinal plants in particular seem to have myriad different names.

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