Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
rainymike

Social Security Benefits for Dependents

Recommended Posts

USMC-Retired

Let me correct something, your spouse can collect on your record at 50 if disabled or 62. As long as you are collecting or dead and she has not remarried.  She must meet the 5 year rule also.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Headshot

Tim, you are incorrect on the rule for children. They collect a Social Security benefit until they are 18 whether or not they are in the US. For wives, they must live in the US to collect, but not for the children. Since the children must already be US citizens before they can collect SSA benefits, the resident rule does NOT apply to them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
USMC-Retired

Bill not going to argue with you I work there and wanted to share this because it is vital.  Here is my refrence to the subject I will await you to post something.  I am not wrong and to make easier read section F.  So if your children are collecting you have gone into an overpayment and in the case of your demise she will be left to repay it.  So please Bill before you look foolish know what you are talking about.  This is the reason I left a bunch of sea lawyers giving bad advice so when good advice comes along it is discarded.   

https://secure.ssa.gov/apps10/poms.nsf/lnx/0302610030

C1 is child #1 

To quote:

C1 can be paid benefits for the first 6 months he/she is outside the U.S. from October 2006 through March 2007 because C1 is a newborn child. C1’s benefits are placed in alien suspense (SJ) effective April 2007, the 7th month of absence from the U.S. because each parent did not reside in the U.S. for 5 years. Only A resided in the U.S. for 5 years.

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Headshot

Tim, if you are only talking about ALIEN children (those who are NOT US citizens), then you are correct. If you think this applies to children who are US citizens, then you are still mistaken. IF the child is a US citizen, the paragraph you referred to does NOT apply. It only applies to ALIEN children (those who do not have US citizenship. If you are now working for the SSA, then you need to check again. The SSA benefits manager in the US Embassy in Manila said you are wrong.

Quote

An alien who is entitled to benefits as the natural child of a living or deceased NH must meet the following requirements:

•The child must have resided in the U. S. for 5 or more years as the child of the parent on whose earnings record entitlement is based; or

•The parent on whose earnings record the child is entitled and other parent (if any, See (RS 02610.035) - Determining the Other Parent) must each have either resided in the U.S. for 5 or more years

 

Edited by Headshot

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
USMC-Retired

Ok Bill, you go on.  She will get zero because you are wrong.   You do not think they understand your child is a US Citzen.  Now if you do not have an overpayment move back the child will get benifits as a dependent child.  But you are outside the US.  Different rules.  I swapped the SSA jargon so it can be read.  Right from the link:

BILL lived in the U.S. from 1970 through 2003 and became entitled to benefits in November 2005. BILL moved to the Philippines and married in January 2006. BILL and his young wife have a child on September 10, 2006.

BILL'S WIFE and CHILD become entitled as dependents on BILL’s earnings record in October 2006.

BILL'S WIFE cannot receive benefits because she did not reside in the U.S. while married to BILL for 5 years. Her benefit is placed in alien suspense (SJ). BILL'S wife would have to stay in the U.S. for a full calendar month to receive benefits, See (RS 02610.001) - Alien Nonpayment Provisions.

BILL'S CHILD can be paid benefits for the first 6 months he/she is outside the U.S. from October 2006 through March 2007 because BILL'S CHILD is a newborn child. BILL'S CHILD benefits are placed in alien suspense (SJ) effective April 2007, the 7th month of absence from the U.S. because each parent did not reside in the U.S. for 5 years. Only A resided in the U.S. for 5 years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
USMC-Retired

Bill post the refrences I will be glad say I am wrong.  As every refrence and every rule has appeals and exceptions.  

Edited by USMC-Retired

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Salty Dog

If someone who is collecting SS has dependent children, does the money for the children go to the children or does it just increase the  amount to the parent...

There are many retired expats living in the Philippines who had children there. Some aren't even married to the child's mother. The children have never been to the US, but have been collecting SS and have been for years. 

You would think that when they set it up in Manila, that the SS office there would make it clear to them, if they are going to lose the child's SS after 6 months.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Headshot
1 minute ago, USMC-Retired said:

Bill post the refrences I will be glad say I am wrong.  

I just posted the reference (Paragraph E). It is from the same source you used (the SSA site). Did you somehow miss the word ALIEN? An alien is a non-citizen. You are correct that my spouse cannot receive any benefits unless she has lived in the US for at least five years and is 62 years old, IF she is still an alien. I know that my spouse will NOT receive ANY SSA benefits unless she lives in the US for five years (at which point she will likely be a US citizen anyway). Back up to Paragraph E and read it carefully. In fact, this entire section deals with aliens. The reference you gave applied to babies who have NOT been granted US citizenship (for whatever reason). A baby can be set up for up to six months BEFORE they either receive citizenship or lose their SSA benefits. My daughter was NOT a baby when I applied for my SSA benefits. She was already a US citizen. I asked a lot of questions when we were at the SSA office, and everything they said is is contradiction to what you are saying (for US citizens).

In any event, don't lose any sleep over it. We are still planning a move to the US.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Salty Dog
Quote

 

A. Policy

In 1983 the Social Security Act was amended (P.L. 98-21) section 340 to include an additional provision regarding the payment of Social Security benefits to aliens outside the U.S. Section 202(t)(11) of the Social Security Act requires that certain non-U.S. citizen dependent and survivor beneficiaries who are first eligible for Social Security Benefits after December 1984, must have resided in the U.S. for at least 5 years as the spouse, widow/widower, child, or parent of the NH, in order to receive U.S. benefits while outside the U.S.. See RS 02610.030 - 5 Year Residency Requirements for Spouses, Natural Child, Adopted Child, and a Parent

 

The quote above at the beginning of the section Tim quoted says aliens.

US Citizens are not aliens. 

Could it be that this only applies to children who haven't become US citizens.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Headshot
4 minutes ago, Salty Dog said:

If someone who is collecting SS has dependent children, does the money for the children go to the children or does it just increase the  amount to the parent...

It MUST go into an account that is in the child's name AND is NOT under the SSA recipient's (parent's) control. My daughter's account has my wife's name on it as a guardian.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
USMC-Retired

When you establish an account for a child you create a representive payee.  In lets say Bill's case his wife does not meet the residency requirements so Bill is the payee on the account.  

Don the example in the refrence is very clear and leaves no room.  Your question about citzenship is two fold. First they know they are citzens and this rule only applies to residency requiring countries.  Phillipines is one of those.  

Edited by USMC-Retired

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Salty Dog
Just now, Headshot said:

It MUST go into an account that is in the child's name AND is NOT under the SSA recipient's (parent's) control. My daughter's account has my wife's name on it as a guardian.

So not only do you get extra benefits (paid to your daughter) , but you don't have to pay taxes on the additional benefits...:rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Headshot
1 minute ago, USMC-Retired said:

First they know they are citzens and this rule only applies to residency requiring countries.  Phillipines is one of those.  

NO. They do NOT automatically know that a dependent is a US citizen. There are MANY dependent children of US citizens who never receive US citizenship (for whatever reason). I personally know guys who have elected not to apply for US citizenship for their children. Yes, they are stupid, but they think their reasons are good. Those kids still qualify for SSA benefits IF they fall under the rules of the section you referenced. It sounds like their world falls apart if their father dies.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
USMC-Retired

Ok Bill read the example follow what are residency requiring countries.  You want this to fit your widget because you need it to.  I have zero fight in this and gave factual examples with refrences.  Certian countries that rule does not apply, did they now just assume they were citizens.  No. 

When you go to manila file for benifits they give them to you.  You rate them.  They assume you will return meet the requirements or stop them.  It is on you.  

Most do neither and when they die there widow has a shock.  

Your children will always rate your benifits in the USA.  Just think about how this rule stops guys from having a zillion kids on SSA roles.  

 

Edited by USMC-Retired

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
USMC-Retired

Here is the public version of my reference.  Make your own decisions.  What I said is all contained in here.  

https://www.ssa.gov/pubs/EN-05-10137.pdf

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

  • Commercial Banner Advertisers

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use, Privacy Policy and Guidelines. We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue..