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cookie47

Philippine Electrical

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Steven Mactan
On 7/14/2018 at 1:20 PM, cookie47 said:

 

Help please.....

 

Although not qualified I'm ok with Australian 230 volt wiring (Australian colours and systems ) HOWEVER,

We have just moved into a new house and purchased new appliances. (Fridge, water cooler, microwave) The house has all three pin sockets (with round earth pin).

The appliances all have TWO pin PLUGS plus a completely separate green earth WIRE Attached to the chassis of the appliances .I asked the electrician through my wife what's the method of connecting the earth wire.

He says drill hole in wall and use screw, REALLY,!!!!.ON A NEW HOUSE.

I also asked him if the house had a safety switch= "RCD" he said what's a safety switch??. emoji848.png

None of the fuses are marked btw.

And no safety switch visible in fusebox. X2

The sockets do not have in built safety rcd/earth leakage device either. (as seen in the U.S on YouTube).

I've also looked outside the house for an earth stake (As expected in Australia) I can see one at the pole but is this related to my house. and in fact ARE the sockets earthed at all. I haven't bothered to investigate.

 

So back to these earth wires.

 

There only a meter long max. I've been to some houses and seen this wire not used particularly on fridges , but is this acceptable. I think not, because if the appliance became faulty no earth to stop you getting zapped...

 

Am i missing something here.

 

Thanks.

 

I had the same problem when I built my house here in Cebu a few years back.  I purchased three prong receptacles for the electrician to install in my new house, and then I returned home to the states to take care of some unfinished business.  

When I got back to the Philippines I noticed that my wife and the helper were getting electrical shocks from the microwave and refrigerator, and that I was also getting electrical shocks from my desktop PC.  To make a longs story short, I shut off the power and pulled out some of the newly installed receptacles to see what was going on.  However, when I looked inside the electrical boxes I found that the electrician did not run a ground wire as I had asked him to do, and that he had used green 2 MM stranded Thhn wire for both the hot and neutral!

I specifically told this guy that I wanted 12 gauge Thhn wire, and that I wanted black for the hot side of the circuit, white for the neutral side, and green for the grounding wire.  When I asked him about this he said "Sir, here in the Philippines the ground slot on the receptacle is just a decoration, and we do not used it for anything."  

Well, since then I've replaced all the wire leading to my electrical receptacles and I've also added makeshift grounding rod to my household electrical system as well.  

Below is a link to blog article I found on this topic.  

http://erics-watkinson-opinion.blogspot.com/2017/04/all-about-electric-shocks-from-desktop_26.html

Edited by Steven Mactan

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Steven Mactan

Below is a picture of the residual breaker I had installed on the side of my house.  I think that I picked up the metal weather proof box at Ace or True Value for around 800 Pesos, and then the RCD breaker in the photo cost about 600 Pesos.  The black and white wires leading from the bottom of the RCD breaker lead into the house and they are connected to the first breaker on the left hand side of my breaker panel.  (Usually the upper left breaker in your panel will carry the mains into the panel, and when you turn this particular breaker off, everything inside your house will then be off.)

Main_Res_Breaker_a.JPG

Main_Entrance_a.JPG

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Woolf

@Steven Mactan

Who is your electricity supplyer ?

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Steven Mactan
Just now, Woolf said:

@Steven Mactan

Who is your electricity supplyer ?

If I can't find what I'm looking for at Wilcon, Cebu Home Builders, Ace or True Value, then I usually go to a place called Cebu Tri Star in Mandaue.  

http://cebutristarcorporation.blogspot.com/p/about-us.html

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Steven Mactan
5 minutes ago, Woolf said:

@Steven Mactan

Who is your electricity supplyer ?

I'm sorry I misunderstood your question.  My electricity is from MECO, and they seem to have a similar configuration to CEBECO in your drawing.  Although, sometimes you have to watch it, because sometimes when the power comes back after a brown out, the hot and neutral have switched sides.  

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Woolf

Hmm

@Steven Mactan

utility company    VECO  ??

Are you on mactan ?? 

As far as I know Mactan Electric Company uses hot and neutral, VECO use 2 hots

btw I think the source to the RCD breaker should be at the bottom

In think that it is not that important but normally the source it at the bottom

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cookie47
I had the same problem when I built my house here in Cebu a few years back.  I purchased three prong receptacles for the electrician to install in my new house, and then I returned home to the states to take care of some unfinished business.  
When I got back to the Philippines I noticed that my wife and the helper were getting electrical shocks from the microwave and refrigerator, and that I was also getting electrical shocks from my desktop PC.  To make a longs story short, I shut off the power and pulled out some of the newly installed receptacles to see what was going on.  However, when I looked inside the electrical boxes I found that the electrician did not run a ground wire as I had asked him to do, and that he had used green 2 MM stranded Thhn wire for both the hot and neutral!
I specifically told this guy that I wanted 12 gauge Thhn wire, and that I wanted black for the hot side of the circuit, white for the neutral side, and green for the grounding wire.  When I asked him about this he said "Sir, here in the Philippines the ground slot on the receptacle is just a decoration, and we do not used it for anything."  
Well, since then I've replaced all the wire leading to my electrical receptacles and I've also added makeshift grounding rod to my household electrical system as well.  
Below is a link to blog article I found on this topic.  
http://erics-watkinson-opinion.blogspot.com/2017/04/all-about-electric-shocks-from-desktop_26.html
Update, Hi Steven.
We are now moved into the house.

I investigated behind one of the three pin outlets. No earth wire at all,IN FACT the earth does not have a tab or mount for a wire, but the earth IS connected to one of the mount screws which butts up to the base plate mounted in the concrete wall. The house is 100%concrete...

This is crazy.
All the wires are blue throughout the house. Diagnostics would be a nightmare regarding "hot".Luckily I'm good with a multimeter.
They must have got a cheap run on blue wiring. .... Ha. Yet we are talking about a new sub division, not a shack in the province.

I've connected the earth on the microwave to the outlet mount screw then covered with trim plate. Same as the guy who fitted hot water in shower.

I've Yet to finish the fridge and water cooler BUT, No tingles even in bare feet. The Veco man said "its the way we wire so no earth needed.???? However this was thru a translated conversation.

To put an earth rod for me would be a nightmare in my opinion. As seeing that the outlets don't have an earth, in reality I'm just running with it at present.




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cookie47

@Woolf, High Mate...
Still following your info, our posts were very close/overlapped in publishing.


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cookie47

I read on the internet that there are Thermal fuses with a built in Rsd. Like a duel purpose device . In other words one for each separate circuit, rather than the typical single unit as I'm used to in Australia.???

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cookie47
I read on the internet that there are Thermal fuses with a built in Rsd. Like a duel purpose device . In other words one for each separate circuit, rather than the typical single unit as I'm used to in Australia.???

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Correction RCD.

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Woolf
7 minutes ago, cookie47 said:

This is crazy.
All the wires are blue throughout the house. Diagnostics would be a nightmare regarding "hot".Luckily I'm good with a multimeter.
They must have got a cheap run on blue wiring. .... Ha. Yet we are talking about a new sub division, not a shack in the province.

You are in the VECO area so all wires are hot, no need for different colors

maybe they could use different for switched wire but not so important

Could you take a picture of your breaker panel ?

 

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Woolf
11 minutes ago, cookie47 said:

I read on the internet that there are Thermal fuses with a built in Rsd. Like a duel purpose device . In other words one for each separate circuit, rather than the typical single unit as I'm used to in Australia.???

Sent from my Redmi Note 3 using Tapatalk
 

Here you see a 16 amp  combined 

In Denmark we always use dual pole breakers, also break neutral

Kombi.Hpfi 1P+N B16A 30Ma

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cookie47
You are in the VECO area so all wires are hot, no need for different colors
maybe they could use different for switched wire but not so important
Could you take a picture of your breaker panel ?
 
Yes, i just realized what i said myself.
As you say two hots makes no difference in colour.

Will send picture in morning.



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Woolf

Bellow you will see a  typical IMI filter, used in most electronic and electric devices

the 2 capacitors close to terminal 3 and 4 will act as a voltage divider 

If terminal 1 and 2 are supplied with 2 hots like in VECO, the center point of the 2 capacitors

will be  0 (ZERO)

If terminal 1 is hot and terminal 2 is neutral like with cebeco the  center point will be 110/120 v ac

that is if no ground, the current that can flow through the capacitor at 60 Hz is very very low

will not trip a RCD and it will NOT kill you, but it enough to give you a good shock

130796117766108286_FilterFAQ_how%20Image%201.jpg

typical EMI filter

Relateret billede

Edited by Woolf
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Woolf

add to my post above

the Cy capacitors are typical 3300 pF

I calculated the max current to be 0.15 mA

most safety breakers  kick out a 30 mA

Edited by Woolf
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