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Economy: gloom or doom?


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In my opinion, everything scianna54 has said is correct. But look closer. Are the world leaders really that stupid and inept? No, it is their clever plan to wreck the world's economies. The global wealthy elite (Illuminati, CFR, Trilateral Commision, etc.) want total political power and control of the world's money. This is leading up to a one world government or New World Order.

 

http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/10527

http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/10743

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mattwilkie
In my opinion, everything scianna54 has said is correct. But look closer. Are the world leaders really that stupid and inept? No, it is their clever plan to wreck the world's economies. The global wealthy elite (Illuminati, CFR, Trilateral Commision, etc.) want total political power and control of the world's money. This is leading up to a one world government or New World Order.

 

http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/10527

http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/10743

 

The wings of the free are definitly being clipped but is it the fact global new world domination is the problem or more to do with wealthy realliging the minions?

E.g. cripple the population until they need to work rather than "want to". This then decreases the cost of a labour force and in turn removes a lot of the human rights and work ethics.. As Margaret Thatcher once wanted a return to a victorian era and there is a good chance she will get it. From the UK point of view i see the changes are pushing the workers against the benefit class. The things such as the G20 summit did anyone actually know what people were protesting about as the media pushed the rioting etc. but not any actual reasons of why people were there in the first place. I think whats going to happen is a forced collapse by keeping the spending going until it goes pop. In return we could see the end of the benefit system which is a blessing aswell as a curse. No safety net if no job which means the poor are off to the soup kitchen instead of collecting an unemployment cheque. Over the years ive seen the politicians talk talk talk but never listen once, well its the same in most government organisations for example schools will always overspend a budget in the hope they get a bigger one next time. They will never underspend because it will be reduced. They put kids before costs the same as most social organisations. Ok you are probably thinking they should.. but what business runs like this and would be operating after 12 months without a bail out? I could shave billions of pounds off the cost of most councils but realistically they dont want it! because they are in the spending game not earning or finding a way to develop services.

 

I once came across a painter who worked for the council in one of my boroughs. The council stopped painting properties there years ago so they made him more of a cleaner emptying out properties for the next tennant. He suffers with allergies which meant that he would work for a week and then be ill for two from the dust. This guy had worked there years! These are the reasons we bleed cash every week. Most council budgets can be cut by at least 1/3rd yet each year they ask for more money. The UK government has increased its voters or should i say government workers to a an unsustainable level. Its going to crash and its going to crash hard. But my point being if you have a few

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USMC-Retired

If what has been predicted comes true you are talking total anarchy. The world would go into a state where money becomes useless and people would barter for goods. The collapse of trust in the central government to control funds and monetary value would be a huge step backwards.

 

So as for your opinion I hope you are wrong with that. Everyone has the right to an opinion and do you realize what exactly you are predicting.

 

Thus I think it will correct it self over the long term. Maybe not 9 months or year or even two years.

 

The safe guards that were in place during the 1920's are not relevant now. However the lack and failure of the governments to minimize it and correct it are.

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USMC and others, why do you say that FIAT currencies have collapsed and we have overcome it. When was that? 1929? Oh well, we are talking about the US dollar here.

 

China will be the new world power and they are not stagnating in population growth.

 

All the power remaining to the US and Europe is running what is left into the ground, look by whom - a cocaine addict and some other guys who are accused of war crimes, supported by the US government, the most corrupt one ever.

 

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USMC-Retired

The problem is that the US dollar is held in place by world currencies. So if the the dollar collapses then there goes the world currency. The dollar is not just a US currency it is a world currency. You can not predict that only the dollar would collapse.

 

Additionally world markets today and for the next several years would depend on US consumption.

 

So you can not predict one with out the other.

 

As for FIAT Currency. They have been known to collapse and there was no recovery from it. The adoption of the EU and Euro was an example. Germany in the 1913's and France in the 1800's. China and the flying currency. However alot of people say the dollar has already collapsed. It has lost 92% of its value since the 1934s. Most economist believe that the dollar will be replaced. Either on the global scale or by the US government themselves. Also economists also believe that there is little faith in the US dollar however who do they sell goods to. Again their lies the problem.

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Alan S

Bringing the Euro into this thread is probably a diversion as it was established for purely political rther than any economic reason.

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Effervescent
USMC and others, why do you say that FIAT currencies have collapsed and we have overcome it. When was that? 1929? Oh well, we are talking about the US dollar here.

 

China will be the new world power and they are not stagnating in population growth.

 

All the power remaining to the US and Europe is running what is left into the ground, look by whom - a cocaine addict and some other guys who are accused of war crimes, supported by the US government, the most corrupt one ever.

 

.

 

I'm not even sure I'm understanding this correctly. If we did not overcome it, how would we exist. Of course we overcame it as we are still here, alive, and doing commerce. Humanity has survived dozens of collapses and has usually simply restarted the same system again. An article with some history, but in modern times think Argentina who had 3 collapses, Zimbabwe is in one now.

http://dailyreckoning.com/fiat-currency/

 

When the current currency collapses there will just be another one waiting. Print a new one and start over as we always have. When a currency collapses it is the same as declaring bankruptcy on a national level. That's all.

 

Things always look grim for any nation near the collapse. But was there anarchy after 1929? Did the country end its existence? No, but there were changes. The gap between rich and poor got larger, and it will become even more so. Life could be difficult for some definitely, as it was during the great depression.

 

The US is insolvent. It is taking on 3 billion in loans each day just to continue functioning. China is now taking payment in metals such as copper instead of US dollars and is just stashing the metal, which is abnormal when in a world manufacturing decline they should be using much less.

 

http://www.ccun.org/Opinion%20Editorials/2...s-Pritchard.htm

 

The world is just changing, and change always brings fear. People are scared of change and there will be many doomsayers predicting imminent rapture. Being bankrupt isn't the end of the world. Many people have returned from bankruptcy and become very successful.

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Hmm, what again? The EU and Euro collapsed? When was that?

 

Remember, I mentioned technology, the century 2000 being the one which is the century of technological development, 1900 was machinery/manufacturing and stuff, 2100 century (where we are now) is the century of exhausting the world's resources.

 

Yes, the US dollar is going, not the people (cause most know better) but the currency. We will soon see a dramatic drop/depreciation in the US currency. Anybody wondering when it will happen, SOON.

 

Friends, you really have to read between the lines very carefully. Last week for example, we had so much good news about economy recovering, recession is over, blah blah, but still the stock Indexes didn't gain a lot, selling over 860 is still on the table.

 

Too much good news is bad news.

 

.

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USMC-Retired

Wrong answer. Read on Fiat Currency. In 1992 several European countries suffered a huge devalue of currency. Thus they had a solution to create a NEW FIAT currency. Thus the Euro came to life. It has to do with Fiat Currency. Understanding how and why they fail. Ruble, Lira (Turkish), Mexican Peso all have suffered similar fates and they created a new currency to combat this devaluation of currency. So no the Euro is not a diversion. It is a historical lesson on FIAT currency. The US dollar may suffer the same fate. Thus I said there would be a creation of a new currency either on the world market or US federal reserve.

 

Again consumption is the key here. Until countries stop accepting the dollar it will not happen. Currently that has not happen and though confidence is down. The dollar still remains strong. However the constant printing of dollars to pay debt will cause the dollar to go the way of the Zimbabwe dollar. Once trading at a rate of more then 1 dollar to US dollar. Another example of FIAT currency failure.

 

I never said the Euro collapsed.

As for FIAT Currency. They have been known to collapse and there was no recovery from it. The adoption of the EU and Euro was an example.

 

I said it was born out of the failure of FIAT currency. I also said that currency will be born on the failure of current FIAT currency.

Edited by USMC-Retired
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Effervescent
Hmm, what again? The EU and Euro collapsed? When was that?

 

Remember, I mentioned technology, the century 2000 being the one which is the century of technological development, 1900 was machinery/manufacturing and stuff, 2100 century (where we are now) is the century of exhausting the world's resources.

 

Yes, the US dollar is going, not the people (cause most know better) but the currency. We will soon see a dramatic drop/depreciation in the US currency. Anybody wondering when it will happen, SOON.

 

Friends, you really have to read between the lines very carefully. Last week for example, we had so much good news about economy recovering, recession is over, blah blah, but still the stock Indexes didn't gain a lot, selling over 860 is still on the table.

 

Too much good news is bad news.

 

.

 

You're 100% correct. The US dollar is in its death throws. No country is going to throw good money after bad. It is a black hole and everyone knows it now. Lend the US more money so that.. we can lend them more money again? We ARE listening to you!

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USMC-Retired
You're 100% correct. The US dollar is in its death throws. No country is going to throw good money after bad. It is a black hole and everyone knows it now. Lend the US more money so that.. we can lend them more money again? We ARE listening to you!

 

The problem it has not stopped. It has not stopped even as of today. What if the US did what other countries did and just printed a new bill and did not honor the old. Hmmm interesting. Or just printed a new bill and phased out the dollar over time with deprecating returns. The debt would be cut significantly.

 

Countries and investors have not stopped buying dollars. Look at the currency trades for last week.

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Effervescent
The problem it has not stopped. It has not stopped even as of today. What if the US did what other countries did and just printed a new bill and did not honor the old. Hmmm interesting. Or just printed a new bill and phased out the dollar over time with deprecating returns. The debt would be cut significantly.

 

Countries and investors have not stopped buying dollars. Look at the currency trades for last week.

 

A possible theory was that the US would have 2 currencies. The current one we have now, and also begin to issue a new currency backed by a metal or anything else solid This would mean that the debts owed currently would be owed in the old currency. The old currency would of course devalue when the new backed currency is also in circulation as no one would want the old fiat currency. As the old currency imploded, so would all of the US debt which is owed in it.

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Alan S

The largest holder of US debt is China and so they have a vested interest in maintaining the value of the US$, or at least, making sure it doesnt drop too far.

 

It is all too easy, because it is "traditional" to look at US finances and financial problems in isolation. It would be more constructive to look at China, and the other emerging nations, including India, to see what is in their best interests, because that is what they will follow, and they have the might that the US no longer has. Also, they have the freedom to do what they want as they are less "under the spotlight" than are the western nations.

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Effervescent
The largest holder of US debt is China and so they have a vested interest in maintaining the value of the US$, or at least, making sure it doesnt drop too far.

 

It is all too easy, because it is "traditional" to look at US finances and financial problems in isolation. It would be more constructive to look at China, and the other emerging nations, including India, to see what is in their best interests, because that is what they will follow, and they have the might that the US no longer has. Also, they have the freedom to do what they want as they are less "under the spotlight" than are the western nations.

 

It is often argued that the debt holding countries would never endanger their own investment, which is the US debt they hold. There is a glaring problem with this argument. The only time that this debt that they hold has any value is if they can change it back into usable goods. Who will they trade this debt to for a usable product when no one wants it? If they can not trade this debt in for real wealth then its value is actually nothing. In that case they are not risking anything at all by having it fall to worthless or near worthless paper, and they have every reason not to accept even more of it for real resources which it appears more likely it can never be cashed in for.

 

The reason we do need to look at the US in isolation is because no one else has control of their currency. Only the US can print it. Only the US can lend it. Only the US can borrow more of it. Only the US can choose to run a trade deficit. No one else can control these things. If the US was running a fiscally stable and responsible economy the world would use the US dollar perhaps for an indefinite period of time. There would be no reason not to. The focus is on the US because only they have the ability to crash their own currency. We choose to look at China, EU, Japan, etc in terms of currencies only because we no longer see the US currency as the economic rock that it use to be. The US is under the spotlight because if any of the worlds financial institutions should fail, as they just recent have, it is theirs that have the largest effect on the most people. When it crashes it will be these other currencies or combination of which will fill the void and become the new world standard.

 

Just adding a link that seems significant to the thread.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/artic...I9kezxnP4jgoGZQ

Edited by Effervescent
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